Wow. This is exactly what I've been harping on for months. Jerry Crasnick of ESPN rated the top 5 and worst 5 offenses in MLB. The Giants are rated the worst, behind the Pirates, Nationals and the Royals.

30. San Francisco Giants


Current batting order: (1) Dave Roberts, LF; (2) Omar Vizquel, SS; (3) Randy Winn, RF; (4) Ray Durham, 2B; (5) Rich Aurilia or Dan Ortmeier, 1B; (6) Bengie Molina, C; (7) Kevin Frandsen, 3B; (8) Fred Lewis or Rajai Davis, CF.

Did you know the Giants ranked last in the majors in 2007 with a .387 slugging percentage -- and that was with Barry Bonds?

Now that Bonds is gone, San Francisco has a mix of veterans past their primes and young players who aren't as good as the talent the Rockies, Diamondbacks and Dodgers are running out there.

The Giants made a run at Miguel Cabrera, but you never got the sense that they were really in it. The fact that general manager Brian Sabean is even considering a "Tim Lincecum for Alex Rios or Hideki Matsui" deal shows you how desperate San Francisco is for offense these days.

Brian Sabean should be fired. He's let this happen over the past five seasons, allowing an aging lineup to fade away to nothing while drafting pitching ahead of hitting. The Giants are a top 10 payroll caliber team and this is what we have?

I'm not sure if you guys know about this or not, but tomorrow, George Mitchell, the steriod investigator, has said that he will name between sixty and eighty names of current and former MLB players that took performance inhancing drugs. I am expecting Bonds, Clemens, Tejada, Sosa, and possibly A-Rod on that list.

Oh, and now that we signed Rowand I doubt very much we'll be trading for Godzilla and I'm 100% sure we won't be trading Lincecum for Rios. So... no talent leaves.

sfsfsfgiants wrote:I'm not sure if you guys know about this or not, but tomorrow, George Mitchell, the steriod investigator, has said that he will name between sixty and eighty names of current and former MLB players that took performance inhancing drugs. I am expecting Bonds, Clemens, Tejada, Sosa, and possibly A-Rod on that list.

Yup, Bonds is mentioned. So it Clemens... FINALLY! Freakin' media never says **** about him when it isn't that obvious that he does take 'em. I mean c'mon... the dude is like 44 years old and he's still pitching like that?

And from what I've read, about 80 of those players that were caught played for the Yankees. Mwahaha, yes! I love it already.

I thought I would list all the players, not in alphabetical order. I will bold the big names, or guys I found interesting.

Benito Santiago
Gary Sheffield
Randy Velarde
Jason Giambi
Jeremy Giambi
Bobby Estalella
Barry Bonds
Marvin Benard
Rick Ankiel
David Bell
Paul Byrd
Jose Canseco
Jay Gibbons
Troy Glaus
Jason Grimsley
Jose Guillen
Darren Holmes
Gary Matthews Jr.
John Rocker
Scott Schoeneweis
Ismael Valdez
Matt Williams
Steve Woodard
Lenny Dykstra
David Segui
Larry Bigbie
Brian Roberts
Jack Cust
Tim Laker
Josias Manzanillo
Todd Hundley
Mark Carreon
Hal Morris
Matt Franco
Rondell White
Andy Pettitte
Roger Clemens
Chuck Knoblauch
Jason Grimsley
Gregg Zaun
David Justice
F.P. Santangelo
Glenallen Hill
Mo Vaughn
Denny Neagle
Ron Villone
Ryan Franklin
Chris Donnels
Todd Williams
Phil Hiatt
Todd Pratt
Kevin Young
Mike Lansing
Cody McKay
Kent Mercker
Adam Piatt
Miguel Tejada
Jason Christiansen
Mike Stanton
Stephen Randolph
Jerry Hairston
Paul Lo Duca
Adam Riggs
Bart Miadich
Fernando Vina
Kevin Brown
Eric Gagne
Mike Bell
Matt Herges
Gary Bennett
Jim Parque
Brendan Donnelly
Chad Allen
Jeff Williams
Exavier "Nook" Logan
Howie Clark
Paxton Crawford
Ken Caminiti
Rafael Palmeiro
Luis Perez
Derrick Turnbow
Ricky Bones
Ricky Stone

Glenallen Hill should get his money back. The stuff didn't really help. LOL

I'm curious to know why there aren't any Boston Red Sox on that list especially the ones that played on the '04 and '07 World Series Championship team.

xbaywarrior wrote:I'm curious to know why there aren't any Boston Red Sox on that list especially the ones that played on the '04 and '07 World Series Championship team.

Probably because there wasn't a BoSox trainer who got busted and ratted out all the players. Lots of these names came from people who were nailed, not the players themselves. There are quite a few teams that are absent from this list. I really doubt they didn't have these same issues.

I guarantee you guys that this is just the tip of the iceberg. Back when it was really bad, the late 1990's, I bet half the league was juicing, and I guarantee you that, somewhere along the lines, we are going to have a hundred or two hundred names mentioned at once. This is just the start. I cant wait to see everyone's reactions to their favorite 'clean' player juicing.

George Mitchell made a great point: "This isnt one isolated incident. This isnt just one player. In my study, I found players from EVERY TEAM in the league..."

Great quote...

I think that we should trade for matsui. he isnt a great outfielder, but he's got some thunder in his bat, and he'd be good for the bay area to have a good japanese baseball player. the giants can see the marketing in that.

another thing i might pursue: cardinals scott rolen. he has 2 years left on his contract, doesn't get along with la russa. he had a bad injury riddled season but when he's right he's a good player.

i dont know what st. louis would be asking, but check out his '06 stats;

142 games
521 at bats
94 runs
154 hits
48 doubles
1 tripple
22 homers
95 rbi
.369 on base%
.518 slugging
.296 batting ave.


rowand, matsui, rolen, along with molina, and thats a pretty good 4 hitters.

can we called Hank aaron too for using steroid..

this is the biggest slap on MLB league....my opinion is forget this things and move on...if in the future any players still using steroid then we can give him the 'end of career'....

StuckInSoCal wrote:

xbaywarrior wrote:I'm curious to know why there aren't any Boston Red Sox on that list especially the ones that played on the '04 and '07 World Series Championship team.

Probably because there wasn't a BoSox trainer who got busted and ratted out all the players. Lots of these names came from people who were nailed, not the players themselves. There are quite a few teams that are absent from this list. I really doubt they didn't have these same issues.

And it might have something to do with the fact that George Mitchell is/or at least was a Front Office advisor for the BoSox...this is only a partial list.

ChronicallyInclined wrote:i dont know what st. louis would be asking;

St Louis just wants to get rid of him. They would give him away for next to nothing. Their biggest issue with trading him is the fact that he is such a fan favorite. There could be a mob through the city of St Louis if they trade him. From a baseball standpoint, they need to part ways. I'd love to see the Giants snatch him up for Misch or Correia or something along those lines. The Cards would probably ask for Sanchez, and I wouldnt do this. If we dont overpay, though, I would love to see Rolen in Giants colors. The reason teams wont touch him is because of his massive contract. I'm thinking that he makes 13 million a year or something. Dont quote me on that, though.

yeah rolen is making some dough, but i believe its only 2 years, and villalona will probably be in the picture by then.

i hear rumor from yahoo that the giants are showing interest in former blue chipper from the angels, 1b/3b dallas mcpherson. his biggest problem has been his health, apparently he is on the comeback trail from back sugery. it'd be a low risk/high reward type of move, the angels got rid of glaus because they said dallas had 40hr potential. the kid is still only 27. might be worth a look, and fare better with a change of scenery?

I'd be willing to look at McPherson. We still don't have a set first baseman (I'd, personally, love to see them stick Shierholtz there full time, but I doubt that'll happen).