The San Fransisco Giants Thread

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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 5:50 pm
Whats up, Bay Area faithful. Figured its about time to create a thread specifically for the Giants' upcoming season... and all the issues that come and go during it. Personally, I'm looking forward to:

- Barry Bonds breaking the record... hopefully, off of Jason Schmidt & the Blue Homo's :wink:
- Eliezer (sp?) Alfonso totally breaking out... and becoming the G's catcher of the future (dunno WHY we signed Molina...?)
- Kruk & Kipe... 'nuff said.
- The continued development of Jonathan Sanchez and Tim Lincecum, not to mention Matt Cain and Kevin Frandsen.
- Dave Roberts, Randy Winn, Omar Visquel, and (occasionally) Ray Duram all quietly causing havok for opposing pitchers, while on base.
- Barry Zito & Matt Cain making the Giants rotation look better than it has in years.
- Ryan Klesko having a so-so year, then leaving via free agency.
- Bochi. First decent manager since Dusty Baker (even though many Giants fans still haven't forgiven Dusty for the World Series episode).
- Speaking of the World Series, Russ Ortiz is back.
- Armando Benitez being thrown out on his ass after blowing 5 saves in a row... and then feigning an injury, to make it seem like he wasn't just booted out of the lineup.


Let the baseball season begin!
Last edited by 32 on Thu Mar 01, 2012 5:25 pm, edited 3 times in total.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 16, 2007 7:13 pm
Alright, Go Giants!

I too hope Bonds breaks the record on Schmidt the Traitor. I'd love to see the Giants show him up everytime he pitched against them.

I'm also a fan of Alfonso. The kid was a nice pick up when Matheny went down. He proved he can play. He's not great, but he's smart.

Also can't get enough of the two K's!

Can't wait to see what the young guns have in store for us this year. Especially our rook Lincecum.

Our In and Out Field may not be full of superstars, but these guys can play ball.

Zito and Cain give me a reason to hope this rotation won't let me down.

Glad to see Ortiz back. Old, but oh well.

And I hope Benitez crashes and dies.

Other than that... Let's play some ball!
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 11:52 am
Barry's already got 3 HR's in only 21 AB's...

I know it's only Spring Training... but it looks like the King's back. :wink:
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 12:23 pm
I'm an A's fan, but I have to comment on Lincecum. He once hit 104 MPH on the radar gun. Yeah, that's the fastest in the majors if he makes it this season.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 1:20 pm
And the kid's barely 170 pounds, too! That's crazy! Check this quote from the latest ESPN magazine:

Tim Kurkjian wrote:Outside of Barry Bonds, the talk of the Giants' camp is Tim Lincecum, a little right-hander (six-foot, 170) who throws outrageously hard. When Mark Sweeney hit a BP dribbler off Lincecum, the 10th pick of the 2006 draft, the veteran leaped for joy because he'd made contact.


:shock: Kid's gonna be huge. If guys like Sweeney are already happy to just be making CONTACT, I can't imagine where he'll be in a year or two...
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 1:28 pm
32 wrote:And the kid's barely 170 pounds, too! That's crazy! Check this quote from the latest ESPN magazine:

Tim Kurkjian wrote:Outside of Barry Bonds, the talk of the Giants' camp is Tim Lincecum, a little right-hander (six-foot, 170) who throws outrageously hard. When Mark Sweeney hit a BP dribbler off Lincecum, the 10th pick of the 2006 draft, the veteran leaped for joy because he'd made contact.


:shock: Kid's gonna be huge. If guys like Sweeney are already happy to just be making CONTACT, I can't imagine where he'll be in a year or two...


Best closer in the league (that is, if he can surpass my man Huston Street :) )
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 1:33 pm
I'm an A's fan and don't mean to invade your thread but Lincecum is out of this world. I don't understand why you guys don't shop Benitez to Boston for cheap and have Lincecum start the year as a closer.

I mostly want it because I am in a keeper fantasy league this year and I know I am spending a pick on him.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 17, 2007 5:30 pm
Hey, don't look at us Giants' fans. :dontknow:

Most of us would unload Benitez for a gatorade. In fact, I'd wager that Armando is hated MORE by Giants fans than Dunleavy was by Warriors fans...
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:07 pm
I can't wait for baseball to begin. It's like my life gets to start again. Even though I think the Giants could easily finish last in the NL West this year, I'm excited nonetheless.

I'm in the 'all for Lincecum closing' camp. I think it would be great for him and the team. He could be like a Verlander, Papelbon, or Street. Plus, Blownitez would be out of the picture. I guess the Giants are saying they really want to bring Lincecum along slowly, and exclusively as a starter. Seems pretty silly to me, but that's the way it's gonna be. I still think we'll see him pitching in SF before season's end.

I have no idea if Blownitez will be traded or not. I'd say there's a 50/50 chance of him staying or going. Part of me says 'yeah, trade him for whatever crappy prospect we can get as long as we relieve ourselves of his suckitude'. But then again, as he's looking pretty good this spring, it would suck to trade him somewhere and have him pitch well, while STILL having to pay most of his salary (which would have to happen, were we to trade him). It's like if we're gonna pay him that much, might as well have him pitching for us, and if he starts to suck, just DFA him. But there's also the real possibility that he just won't ever pitch well with the Giants, and we need to move on regardless. Who knows with that big tub of lard?

I was really optimistic about the pitching staff, thinking Morris would bounce back, and all the like, but they've all looked pretty awful this spring. Morris has been his usual craptastic self, giving up somethin like 8 runs in the first inning of his outing the other day. Cain ain't pitching well, but that doesn't matter, as he's still striking people out and not walking too many batters. He had a bad spring last year, and turned out great after his little implosion to start the year. Zito will be fine, but nowhere near the savio some are looking for. He'll win 16 games at most, but probably more like 13-15, with an ERA somewhere in the 3.80 - 4.30 range. He'll be ok, but not great. Lowry is the big wildcard - if he can pitch well, it could make all the difference from having an average staff, or a really good one. He's looking pretty bad this spring, but the verdict is still out. Ortiz is looking good for the 5th starter spot. I hope he can keep it up throughout the season. His veolocity is up from last year, which is a very very good sign. What's really scary, though, is that he's pitched better than any other starter this spring. Ugh.

The bullpen is poor as usual. Hennessy looks terrible, and I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't make the opening day roster at all. Correia, Kline, and Wilson are all ok, and they should all have spots. Sanchez has looked bad this spring, but I'm all for giving him a bullpen slot, because he's young and is a lefty. Like most people, I think he'll be really good in the future (his ceiling being perhaps one of the best #3 starters in the league, behing Cain and Lincecum, of course). I think Chulk should get a spot, too, as he pitched fairly well last year, he's young and cheap, and you pretty much know what you're getting from him. The other guys (Misch, Munter, Sadler, Taschner) all suck.

Who knows what to expect from this lineup this year? Yeah, Winn could play like he did the second half of '05, but he could also play more like he did last year. Probably somewhere in between. Roberts will be really productive if he gets on base and steals a lot. If Bonds ends up hitting 3rd, with Omar 2nd, the Giants could lead the league in 1st inning runs scored. If Klesko can play decently enough to platoon with Aurilia at 1st and play in the outfield some, that will be a plus. A pretty big if, though. Bonds will be great if he stays healthy. 400 AB's would be awsome. Aurilia is a pretty big key, too. If he can hit .275 and maybe get 16 dinger's or so, he would be helping the team a lot. As far as a starting 1st baseman, though, his are HORRIBLE. Like worst in the league horrible. That's why a platoon of him and Klesko could be serviceable, with Ritchie getting a lot of starts at 3rd. Feliz should be relegated to super-sub on the bench. He is awful at the plate disciplin-wise, and will never learn to lay off the breaking pitches way out of the zone. 200 AB's for Pedro would be nice. His defense is great, which is why he would be perfectly suited to be a sub. As a starting 3rd baseman, his offensive number last year were the worst in all of baseball. Vizquel will be the man, as usual. Ray-ray will probably have a significant drop-off in offensive production from last year, but if he satys healthy will still be productive as far as 2nd baseman go. Just not as #5 hitters go. Frandsen has been dissapointing this spring. He has never really hit well in the majors, and is having a bad spring. I don't think this is the year for him. Sweeney should just be DFA or traded, even though I like the guy. With Klesko, Feliz, and Linden all playing better than him, we have no use for him. Neikro looks good this spring, but I'll never trust him after last yearf. He always hits well in spring and AAA, but suck in the majors. Same with Ellison. Eliezar is not the future catcher of the Giants. He had a great run the first half last year, but fell off after that. He is bad defensively, slow, and has Pedro-esque plate discipline. If the Giants can keep him as a backup, that would be great. Molina was a stupid signing. Too much money, too many years. Bleh. The player I'm looking forward to seeing most is Todd Linden. He was looking great at the end of last season, and is having a good spring. He should be the 4th outfileder, and get lots of AB's and starts at every outfiled position. I also like Bochy a lot. He seems so much more competent and logical than bat-shit crazy old man Alou.

Well, there you have it. Will the Giants be good this year? Probably not. Can they be? Absolutely. Either way, I can't wait for some baseball!
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 3:34 pm
That might have been the longest post I have ever seen.
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 20, 2007 11:14 pm
Sad news... the Giants may consider keeping Benitez because of his "strong" spring training so far. I bet it's an illusion... then soon he'll blow major @#$% come 9th inning during the SEASON, not spring training.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 21, 2007 11:43 am
baytobrooklyn wrote:I can't wait for baseball to begin. It's like my life gets to start again. Even though I think the Giants could easily finish last in the NL West this year, I'm excited nonetheless.

I'm in the 'all for Lincecum closing' camp. I think it would be great for him and the team. He could be like a Verlander, Papelbon, or Street. Plus, Blownitez would be out of the picture. I guess the Giants are saying they really want to bring Lincecum along slowly, and exclusively as a starter. Seems pretty silly to me, but that's the way it's gonna be. I still think we'll see him pitching in SF before season's end.

I have no idea if Blownitez will be traded or not. I'd say there's a 50/50 chance of him staying or going. Part of me says 'yeah, trade him for whatever crappy prospect we can get as long as we relieve ourselves of his suckitude'. But then again, as he's looking pretty good this spring, it would suck to trade him somewhere and have him pitch well, while STILL having to pay most of his salary (which would have to happen, were we to trade him). It's like if we're gonna pay him that much, might as well have him pitching for us, and if he starts to suck, just DFA him. But there's also the real possibility that he just won't ever pitch well with the Giants, and we need to move on regardless. Who knows with that big tub of lard?

I was really optimistic about the pitching staff, thinking Morris would bounce back, and all the like, but they've all looked pretty awful this spring. Morris has been his usual craptastic self, giving up somethin like 8 runs in the first inning of his outing the other day. Cain ain't pitching well, but that doesn't matter, as he's still striking people out and not walking too many batters. He had a bad spring last year, and turned out great after his little implosion to start the year. Zito will be fine, but nowhere near the savio some are looking for. He'll win 16 games at most, but probably more like 13-15, with an ERA somewhere in the 3.80 - 4.30 range. He'll be ok, but not great. Lowry is the big wildcard - if he can pitch well, it could make all the difference from having an average staff, or a really good one. He's looking pretty bad this spring, but the verdict is still out. Ortiz is looking good for the 5th starter spot. I hope he can keep it up throughout the season. His veolocity is up from last year, which is a very very good sign. What's really scary, though, is that he's pitched better than any other starter this spring. Ugh.

The bullpen is poor as usual. Hennessy looks terrible, and I wouldn't be surprised if he didn't make the opening day roster at all. Correia, Kline, and Wilson are all ok, and they should all have spots. Sanchez has looked bad this spring, but I'm all for giving him a bullpen slot, because he's young and is a lefty. Like most people, I think he'll be really good in the future (his ceiling being perhaps one of the best #3 starters in the league, behing Cain and Lincecum, of course). I think Chulk should get a spot, too, as he pitched fairly well last year, he's young and cheap, and you pretty much know what you're getting from him. The other guys (Misch, Munter, Sadler, Taschner) all suck.

Who knows what to expect from this lineup this year? Yeah, Winn could play like he did the second half of '05, but he could also play more like he did last year. Probably somewhere in between. Roberts will be really productive if he gets on base and steals a lot. If Bonds ends up hitting 3rd, with Omar 2nd, the Giants could lead the league in 1st inning runs scored. If Klesko can play decently enough to platoon with Aurilia at 1st and play in the outfield some, that will be a plus. A pretty big if, though. Bonds will be great if he stays healthy. 400 AB's would be awsome. Aurilia is a pretty big key, too. If he can hit .275 and maybe get 16 dinger's or so, he would be helping the team a lot. As far as a starting 1st baseman, though, his are HORRIBLE. Like worst in the league horrible. That's why a platoon of him and Klesko could be serviceable, with Ritchie getting a lot of starts at 3rd. Feliz should be relegated to super-sub on the bench. He is awful at the plate disciplin-wise, and will never learn to lay off the breaking pitches way out of the zone. 200 AB's for Pedro would be nice. His defense is great, which is why he would be perfectly suited to be a sub. As a starting 3rd baseman, his offensive number last year were the worst in all of baseball. Vizquel will be the man, as usual. Ray-ray will probably have a significant drop-off in offensive production from last year, but if he satys healthy will still be productive as far as 2nd baseman go. Just not as #5 hitters go. Frandsen has been dissapointing this spring. He has never really hit well in the majors, and is having a bad spring. I don't think this is the year for him. Sweeney should just be DFA or traded, even though I like the guy. With Klesko, Feliz, and Linden all playing better than him, we have no use for him. Neikro looks good this spring, but I'll never trust him after last yearf. He always hits well in spring and AAA, but suck in the majors. Same with Ellison. Eliezar is not the future catcher of the Giants. He had a great run the first half last year, but fell off after that. He is bad defensively, slow, and has Pedro-esque plate discipline. If the Giants can keep him as a backup, that would be great. Molina was a stupid signing. Too much money, too many years. Bleh. The player I'm looking forward to seeing most is Todd Linden. He was looking great at the end of last season, and is having a good spring. He should be the 4th outfileder, and get lots of AB's and starts at every outfiled position. I also like Bochy a lot. He seems so much more competent and logical than bat-**** crazy old man Alou.

Well, there you have it. Will the Giants be good this year? Probably not. Can they be? Absolutely. Either way, I can't wait for some baseball!

Great analysis! I pretty much agree with everything... couple gripes, though:

- Do you really think Feliz' defense is "great"? I must have seen the guy miss 20 grounders coming straight at him last year. Pedro Feliz was part of the reason Bonds looked so bad in left field; because Barry can't move and Pedro can't catch. Not a bad arm, pretty good on the throw to first, but I wouldn't say he's good at snagging a lotta balls.

- I wouldn't trade Sweeney. Honestly, there's something to be said for players who can come through in the clutch... and Sweeney's definately one of them. Even though we have a good amount of people who can hit the ball, Sweeney's the guy's I wanna see pinching in the middle of a tied 8th inning ballgame.

- The Giants are swallowing Benitez like the Warriors are with Foyle. I think the organization knows it made a bad sign... but they're just gonna deal around him because, like you said, they'd probably end up paying him anyways. I think that's partly why San Fransico's been so concerned with getting good starting pitchers lately (hello? Zito, aka richest pitcher ever): they wanna give Armando a ton of cushion so that when he tosses that meatball with down the pipe, the Giants still have 2 or 3 runs on the other guys. I've said it before: putting Armando in for the save is like putting a middle school in for the save. Occasionally, he'll get it... but you hate having to chance it (and there's something to be said when a closer makes you feel like a 3-run lead isn't far enough :banghead:).
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 7:39 pm
Thanks, man. To answer a few of your points:

Yes, I do think Feliz plays great defense. The first half of last year, he was playing like a gold glove 3rd baseman, which is no exaggeration. I think he just got tired out toward the end of last year, as he had never played close to every day before in his carreer. His hitting and defense were both far superior in the first half, as compared to the last. I expect him not to play at a gold-glove level in the field, but I do expect well above average defense from him, which is why I think he could be a great utility guy, who also has some pop (as those kinds of guys rarely do).

I know what you're saying about Sweeney. He did have a few clutch pinch-hits last year. But, really, one he had to win a game was just a lucky little dribbler to 2nd base that was mis-played by thhe 2nd baseman. He's a great clubhouse guy, and has a great reputation as a pinch-hitter, but in reality, he hit .206 last year as a pinch hitter. Not so great. The thing is, I think we need to trade any combination of Benitez/Niekro/Ellison/Sweeney/Frandsen in order to get a solid bullpen arm. The bullpen is absolutely desolate right now. They could end up costing us the game every 3rd game or so, as it stands now. The only reason I say get rid of Sweeney before Niekro or Ellison, is that those two guys are relativey young, and still have a small chance of putting it together. Furthermore, they're out of options as far as going back to the minors go, and they probably wouldn't make it through wavers, which means if the Giants don't keep them this year, they're gone forever (probably not a big deal either way).

The Giants are going to pay Benitez's salary, no matte what, unfortunately. If only he were as useful as Adonal. I actually really like Adonal now as a backup center. He's probably one of the best in the league. Only problem is he's getting paid like a star. With Benitez, I don't trust him farther than I can thow him. That fat tub of **** sucks ass. Having said that, however, I think it still might be in the Giants' best interest to keep him for the first half of the season. If we can't get a decent prospect or solid bullpen arm for him before the season starts, there's no use in making a trade now. Then if he sucks for the forst half of the season, we just release him. If he's good and the Giants are good, that's all the better. If he's good and the Giants suck, we trade him for someone useful to a club in contention desperate for a closer.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2007 3:08 pm
baytobrooklyn wrote:Yes, I do think Feliz plays great defense. The first half of last year, he was playing like a gold glove 3rd baseman, which is no exaggeration. I think he just got tired out toward the end of last year, as he had never played close to every day before in his carreer. His hitting and defense were both far superior in the first half, as compared to the last. I expect him not to play at a gold-glove level in the field, but I do expect well above average defense from him, which is why I think he could be a great utility guy, who also has some pop (as those kinds of guys rarely do).

... Really? :scratch:

I'm not disagreeing with you; I'm sure you know what you're talking about, but I just didn't see it. I saw Pedro Feliz last season watching ground balls skip through the gap because he didn't feel like diving. I saw Peter Happy juggling grounders like he was in a cirus (and lose a couple on the throw). I even saw him try to make a glove-less snag... and he missed the ball. :oops:

I admit, I didn't see many first-half games of the season (the dorm I was living in blocked out FSN Bay Area) and it wasn't until I moved out, mid-year, that I started consistently catching Giants games... but by that time, Feliz was the guy the opposition was chopping grounders to because they knew that he and Hillenbrand/Niekro/Sweeney were the weak links in the chain.

baytobrooklyn wrote:I know what you're saying about Sweeney. He did have a few clutch pinch-hits last year. But, really, one he had to win a game was just a lucky little dribbler to 2nd base that was mis-played by thhe 2nd baseman. He's a great clubhouse guy, and has a great reputation as a pinch-hitter, but in reality, he hit .206 last year as a pinch hitter. Not so great. The thing is, I think we need to trade any combination of Benitez/Niekro/Ellison/Sweeney/Frandsen in order to get a solid bullpen arm. The bullpen is absolutely desolate right now. They could end up costing us the game every 3rd game or so, as it stands now. The only reason I say get rid of Sweeney before Niekro or Ellison, is that those two guys are relativey young, and still have a small chance of putting it together. Furthermore, they're out of options as far as going back to the minors go, and they probably wouldn't make it through wavers, which means if the Giants don't keep them this year, they're gone forever (probably not a big deal either way).

Hey, you don't get any argument from me about beefing up our relivers. Our bullpen looks like a local competition for the Special Olympics. In fact, besides Vinny Chulk and Mike Stanton, I didn't like ONE guy we put out there last year who wasn't a starter. None. Not Brian Wilson, not Armando Blownitez, not Steve Kline, not even Jeremy Accardo (prior to the trade). I thought they were all horrible.

Speaking of Accardo, I was actually thrilled that we got rid of that guy. A few of my friends disagreed; they said that Jeremy was a little green, but he had good stuff. Honestly, some guys are green and some guys are just terrible. Jonathan Sanchez was green. He'd go a few good innings, than do something stupid and you'd have to pull him out, but you knew the kid was just young and sooner or later he'd be throwing well all night. Jeremy Accardo was just awful. You'd throw him out, he'd strike out the first batter... and it was all downhill from there. A lot of analysts said he might be a future closer... but if he is, I'll bet he's not a good one. Accardo is good for one batter, then he's gassed.

If you're looking for somebody to trade for a decent bullpen guy, I've given up on Lance Niekro. I think he's the first basemen version of Pedro Feliz; power to spare, tons of potential, but unlikely to reach it.

baytobrooklyn wrote:The Giants are going to pay Benitez's salary, no matte what, unfortunately. If only he were as useful as Adonal. I actually really like Adonal now as a backup center. He's probably one of the best in the league. Only problem is he's getting paid like a star. With Benitez, I don't trust him farther than I can thow him. That fat tub of **** sucks ass. Having said that, however, I think it still might be in the Giants' best interest to keep him for the first half of the season. If we can't get a decent prospect or solid bullpen arm for him before the season starts, there's no use in making a trade now. Then if he sucks for the forst half of the season, we just release him. If he's good and the Giants are good, that's all the better. If he's good and the Giants suck, we trade him for someone useful to a club in contention desperate for a closer.

I got a buddy who says that we won't have any problems with Armando this year. He says its his contract season, so he'll likely be throwing well again... and even if he's not, we can always trade him because he's a big expirer. Good riddance, honestly. The guy was the most hated person in Bay Area sports.

Between A's, Giants, Raiders, 49ers, and Warriors... I'd say that the Giants probably have the classiest fans, traditionally. I don't ever recall hearing Giants fans boo their own team... until Armando Benitez (and, even then, they were booing HIM, not the Giants). I hope the guy gets dealt because we could seriously give his spot to Chulk or Linecum and get better results.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2007 10:02 am
Major League Baseball 2K7 is a helluva game, btw.

They give MAJOR respect to Barry Bonds (even though, for infringement reasons, they had to name him "Joe Young" and make him 5'11"... not to mention a few other nit-picky things that I fixed in Edit Player mode). And Zito's 12-6 curve might just be my favorite pitch in the whole damn game.

The realism is off the page: Matt Cain is a strike-out machine, Matt Morris either pitches grounders or gives up runs, and I brought in Armando Benitez with a 4-run lead and he managed to cut it down to 1 before limping through the final out!

I used to play High Heat baseball, by 3DO, but I haven't seen that franchise forever, so I switched to MLB: The Show last season (which didn't thrill me, but it was better than nothing)... however, with the new, PS3 in my household, I felt a change was necessary... and I couldn't be happier with 2K7. :thumbleft:

PS: You also have to rename "Timothy Lincoln" on the AAA Fresno team to "Tim Lincecum". He's 5'11", 175 lbs, and I've thrown 101 MPH pitches with him, so I figured its the same guy. God, I can't wait for him to be ready! :cheers:
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