Players Don Nelson Will Help/Hinder

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Will Nelson's overall effect make the Warriors better or worse as a whole?

Much Better! 50 Wins!
12
29%
He'll wake up Golden State's talent... 40 wins.
26
63%
Nelson won't help. Same record.
2
5%
He'll pull a Larry Brown and actually make the team WORSE.
1
2%
 
Total votes : 41

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 3:40 pm
#32 wrote:Jeez, it's been a little under a week (with a couple Warriors preseason games) since I've posted, and there have been no good new topics to talk about. My God.

Let's try resurrecting a successul one to jump start some conversation:

#32 wrote:Troy Murphy *****
Don Nelson is a huge fan of big men who can play the perimeter. All summer, Troy Murphy had his bags packed. After today, he might as well keep his house payments going. Murphy is incredibly similar to another player Don Nelson made into a star (perhaps you've heard of him): Dirk Nowitski. The only difference between the two (physically) is that Dirk is an inch taller and Murphy is a tad stronger.

What's truly exciting about this is that Murphy has an already-established NBA reputation for improvement. His huge rebounding numbers, outside touch, and movement without the ball were all tricks he picked up after being drafted. If Murphy can add huge points to his game like that, what's stopping him from being everything Nelly can sculpt him into? I'm not saying he'll become the next Dirk overnight... but, if Troy Murphy averages numbers closer to 17 and 10 next year (with improved percentages across the board), I wouldn't be surprised.


If there's one player (other than Dunleavy) that Golden State fans can't decide on, it's Murphy. You can read what i wrote about him above. Any thoughts?


I agree with most every thing you wrote about the Dirk vs. Troy comparison; however, I don't think that Murph can carry the team like Dirk.
Murph can easily attain the 17 ppg. just by increasing his FG %. Totally realistic, along with 10 rpg.
I think the main difference between Dirk and Murph is the way they shoot. Murph shot is text book. It takes time and room. He can miss his shots with a hand in his face, but with Dirk he has a rather unorthodox shot. It's straight over his head where no one can reach it and its quick and money.
Besides their different shooting styles, I feel that Dirk has more of that hard nose (no pun intended) go after it attitude.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 6:40 pm
mamamamarciulionis wrote:I think Murphy is too soft and not very agressive. Even if Murphy is stronger than Dirk, Dirk is a lot agressive than Murphy. I don't think Murphy is ready to step up in a role similar to Dirk. In Dallas Dirk is the number 1 option. In GS, Murphy is the 2nd or even 3rd option. I see him improving a little, but I don't see much change in him. 12pts - 7rebs maybe.

I think guards will play a big part of this year's offense.

:shock: Are you serious, dude?

You expect Murphy (someone Nelson has been raving about since he got hired) to actually decline in a higher-scoring offense? 12 points and 7 boards are 3 knocks per category lower than his averages last year. Trust me, pimpin, Dajuan Wagner (the only real roster change) is NOT gonna make that much of a difference. :wink:

I expect Murphy to improve his percentages up to something closer to 49% from the field, 85% from the line, and 39-40% from the arc. In an offense with BD and Jason bound to cut more (along with Monta and Dajuan getting minutes), Murphy will be left open quite a bit. I don't think it's out of the question to expect 17 PPG (just an extra field goal a night) and his usual 10 boards.

Hell, Nelson's claiming Troy Murphy will average 20 and 10. I'm not that crazy. But I believe he'll improve, no doubt. My hunch is that he'll probably grab 11 or 12 rebounds a night, too.
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 19, 2006 7:57 pm
#32 wrote:
mamamamarciulionis wrote:I think Murphy is too soft and not very agressive. Even if Murphy is stronger than Dirk, Dirk is a lot agressive than Murphy. I don't think Murphy is ready to step up in a role similar to Dirk. In Dallas Dirk is the number 1 option. In GS, Murphy is the 2nd or even 3rd option. I see him improving a little, but I don't see much change in him. 12pts - 7rebs maybe.

I think guards will play a big part of this year's offense.

:shock: Are you serious, dude?

You expect Murphy (someone Nelson has been raving about since he got hired) to actually decline in a higher-scoring offense? 12 points and 7 boards are 3 knocks per category lower than his averages last year. Trust me, pimpin, Dajuan Wagner (the only real roster change) is NOT gonna make that much of a difference. :wink:

I expect Murphy to improve his percentages up to something closer to 49% from the field, 85% from the line, and 39-40% from the arc. In an offense with BD and Jason bound to cut more (along with Monta and Dajuan getting minutes), Murphy will be left open quite a bit. I don't think it's out of the question to expect 17 PPG (just an extra field goal a night) and his usual 10 boards.

Hell, Nelson's claiming Troy Murphy will average 20 and 10. I'm not that crazy. But I believe he'll improve, no doubt. My hunch is that he'll probably grab 11 or 12 rebounds a night, too.


Murphy's numbers on offense can only go up. He should be a step quicker than his defender playing at the pivot position. Also, Murphy should be able to finish a pick and role with an outside shot instead of the expected roll to the basket.

As for rebounding, I don't see his numbers being very large there; however, he should be able to "outquick" most of the other centers in the league.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 2:16 am
#32 wrote: :shock: Are you serious, dude?

You expect Murphy (someone Nelson has been raving about since he got hired) to actually decline in a higher-scoring offense? 12 points and 7 boards are 3 knocks per category lower than his averages last year. Trust me, pimpin, Dajuan Wagner (the only real roster change) is NOT gonna make that much of a difference. :wink:

I expect Murphy to improve his percentages up to something closer to 49% from the field, 85% from the line, and 39-40% from the arc. In an offense with BD and Jason bound to cut more (along with Monta and Dajuan getting minutes), Murphy will be left open quite a bit. I don't think it's out of the question to expect 17 PPG (just an extra field goal a night) and his usual 10 boards.

Hell, Nelson's claiming Troy Murphy will average 20 and 10. I'm not that crazy. But I believe he'll improve, no doubt. My hunch is that he'll probably grab 11 or 12 rebounds a night, too.


The reason I said that Murphy will have 12pts and 7 rebs is because I dont see Murphy running up and down the court 35 to 40 minutes when he is not used to that. He is used to setting up shots running off of screens. It is quite difficult to set your shot comming from a break rather than a set play. Murph will run but he will get tired. He will run on offense and get beat up on defense.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 6:14 am
mamamamarciulionis wrote:The reason I said that Murphy will have 12pts and 7 rebs is because I dont see Murphy running up and down the court 35 to 40 minutes when he is not used to that. He is used to setting up shots running off of screens. It is quite difficult to set your shot comming from a break rather than a set play. Murph will run but he will get tired. He will run on offense and get beat up on defense.



Murphy will go backwards! He is a spot up shooter, as yopu said, and not a runner. He needs to focus on offensive rebounding and putbacks to keep scoring! He will likely fatigue or just get too smashed on defense and Biedrins will take a bigger role! Diogu will also likely get better as the season goes on and Murphy will regress, setting it up for Diogu to take time away from him too
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 6:42 am
migya wrote:
mamamamarciulionis wrote:The reason I said that Murphy will have 12pts and 7 rebs is because I dont see Murphy running up and down the court 35 to 40 minutes when he is not used to that. He is used to setting up shots running off of screens. It is quite difficult to set your shot comming from a break rather than a set play. Murph will run but he will get tired. He will run on offense and get beat up on defense.



Murphy will go backwards! He is a spot up shooter, as yopu said, and not a runner. He needs to focus on offensive rebounding and putbacks to keep scoring! He will likely fatigue or just get too smashed on defense and Biedrins will take a bigger role! Diogu will also likely get better as the season goes on and Murphy will regress, setting it up for Diogu to take time away from him too


Very depressing analysis of Murphy at center...
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:16 am
uptempo wrote:
migya wrote:
mamamamarciulionis wrote:The reason I said that Murphy will have 12pts and 7 rebs is because I dont see Murphy running up and down the court 35 to 40 minutes when he is not used to that. He is used to setting up shots running off of screens. It is quite difficult to set your shot comming from a break rather than a set play. Murph will run but he will get tired. He will run on offense and get beat up on defense.



Murphy will go backwards! He is a spot up shooter, as yopu said, and not a runner. He needs to focus on offensive rebounding and putbacks to keep scoring! He will likely fatigue or just get too smashed on defense and Biedrins will take a bigger role! Diogu will also likely get better as the season goes on and Murphy will regress, setting it up for Diogu to take time away from him too


Very depressing analysis of Murphy at center...



But likely true! Murphy doesn't play defense so he is screwed there and he is not the fastest player around. He will have to make alot of the jumpshots he takes and I'm not so sure there will be many open jumpshots for him unless JRich and Baron get double teamed often. He is also getting softer and that will not help him in anything.

Biedrins has to improve but he is already a better defender, runner and overall athlete. He may be more of a rebounder as well as he has got alot of rebounds in games where he has played more than 20mins. Problem is, he can't stay on the court for that long usuaully because he fouls too much so he has to get better in everything to be considered real starting Center material
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 11:31 am
Okay. Murphy can't run. How many centers in the league can...?

Don't expect 90% of Golden State's possesions to be fast breaks. Faster tempo doesn't mean 48 minutes of pure running. Murphy's offensive numbers (like virtually everyone, sans Foyle) will improve.

The reason I'd give him more rebounds is because there will be more shots in the air. I think Murphy's capable of 12 boards a night in that environment.
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PostPosted: Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:03 pm
#32 wrote:Okay. Murphy can't run. How many centers in the league can...?

Don't expect 90% of Golden State's possesions to be fast breaks. Faster tempo doesn't mean 48 minutes of pure running. Murphy's offensive numbers (like virtually everyone, sans Foyle) will improve.

The reason I'd give him more rebounds is because there will be more shots in the air. I think Murphy's capable of 12 boards a night in that environment.



I don't think EVERYBODY can score more! Some guys will, some guys won't and Murphy is better in a half court set where he can work to get a jumpshot.

It is true that more shots will be taken and likely there will be more misses so maybe the guy can get more rebounds
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 11:24 am
M i the only one worried by the fact we are talking about Murph at 5 and Dun at 4? Why do i see it wrong?
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 2:35 pm
TRON wrote:M i the only one worried by the fact we are talking about Murph at 5 and Dun at 4? Why do i see it wrong?

Because they're both established at other positions and neither can defend the opposition in their new spots. The funny thing is, they couldn't defend their OLD opposition, either, so a mismatch favors them heavily.

Murphy at 5 has been a beautiul thing, thus far, in the preseason. The Warriors are 5-0 and Murph is putting up good numbers. Great move, Nelly!
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 2:40 pm
It looks shaky but that's what in-game adjustments are for. If the other team has an inside monster that's scoring the crap outta Dun and Murph, then Nelson can most certainly put in Biedrins or whoever.
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 21, 2006 9:50 pm
Dun and Murphy are weak at their current position! Dun will have to outquick his opponent and shoot well from the outside to have a chance of being an asset. Murphy will have to shoot well and try his best to outwork his opponents for him to be an asset
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 22, 2006 12:13 am
migya wrote:Dun and Murphy are weak at their current position! Dun will have to outquick his opponent and shoot well from the outside to have a chance of being an asset. Murphy will have to shoot well and try his best to outwork his opponents for him to be an asset


True, and I hope Murphy has the same luck as Hamilton had when he had to wear a mask.
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 22, 2006 9:49 am
migya wrote:Dun and Murphy are weak at their current position! Dun will have to outquick his opponent and shoot well from the outside to have a chance of being an asset. Murphy will have to shoot well and try his best to outwork his opponents for him to be an asset

Great. If Dunleavy shoots around 35%, he'll be above most 4's from the arc.

And Murphy's always been one of the Warriors hardest workers.

This sounds like a great idea. :)
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