A SF from Philly

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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:10 am
Looking at the Philly roster, they get production this season from a variety of players and have no allstar, though they have done well. If the team doesn't keep the lottery pick (or even if it does really), a very good option could also be to trade DWright and the Spurs' late 1st rounder for Even Turner and if Philly say no, then for Thaddeus Young. Both would fit well at starting SF here. Both play some defense and are allround. Turner is getting about 5 million right now and Young gets 7 million.

If the team kept the lottery pick and were not in the top 3, they could get a very good backup big and that'd fill out the team pretty nicely.

End of next season, both AB and RJeff are expirers. That's about 20 million in expirers to use to get one or two very good players here if possible
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migya make the ring fall on ya
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 2:51 pm
I wouldn't mind cherry-picking a small forward from the Sixers. :-k The only issue is figuring out which option will help the team the most while considering what Golden State had to give up.

Young and Turner are attractive, but let's start at the top:

Andre Iguodala

Probable asking price: Andre Iguodala, Elton Brand, for Stephen Curry, David Lee, Andrew Bogut
Probable deal we'd get: Andre Iguodala for Klay Thompson, Richard Jefferson, Charles Jenkins, Epke Udoh Trade Exception, Spurs 2012 1st Rounder, Hawks 2012 2nd Rounder
Prognosis: Green Light

If the Sixers are going to built with Turner at one wing, they ideally would like a Klay Thompson to put on the other for the foreseeable future. A stud athlete with a young sniper is dangerous, as is a backup point guard like Jenkins behind Holiday. The Sixers are set to resign their studs after Brand expires and Jefferson would be gone the year after that.

Golden State, meanwhile, pulls an undeniable coup. In 2009, Curry, Lee, Iguodala, and Bogut were the 4 best players in 4 separate cities. Fill in the blank at 2 or 3; McGuire, Rush, or Wright would be an internal option, but if the Warriors get a top 7 pick this year, we're talking about a dangerous playoff team with a lot of weapons and a lot of years left.

This is my favorite option and both teams win. Philly gets younger at 2 spots (starting 2 and bench point), they shave Iggy's 13 mill a year into RJ's 9 mill, and they obtain 2 more draft picks to build their team. Brand and Jefferson combine for 24 million gone in 3 years (15 after 2). The Warriors get their lead defender and don't sacrifice Thompson's team play for a starter that would demand the ball; Iggy fits right in.

Evan Turner

Probable asking price: Evan Turner for Stephen Curry and Klay Thompson
Probable deal we'd get: Evan Turner, Sam Young, Jru Holiday, Lou Williams, and Maurice Speights Trade Exception for Stephen Curry, Andris Biedrins, Klay Thompson, and Spurs 2012 1st Rounder
Prognosis: Yellow Light

Here's the thing: the Sixers know that Turner has better trade value than anyone between these teams except Curry. And now with Curry's injuries piling up, Philly (like everyone) has bargaining leverage on the Warriors because of it. So what you're looking at, essentially, is a way to deposit Andris Biedrins... But you have to trade your backcourt with Philly to do it.

The Sixers love it. Their starting 5 will definitely improve; Curry is a perfect compliment with a player like Iguodala; as is Thompson. They bring a new weapon to the Sixers, whereas Turner is practically Iggy's stringier doppelgänger. Outside the banging rigors of the pacific division (and it's average starting 5 size of 7 feet), Andris Biedrins could bring a scrappy, energetic boost to the Sixer front court. Offensively, with Brand in the midrange and Hawes living on the arc, Biedrins would be ideal as a Doug Collins banger playing off the offensive post.

The Warriors, meanwhile, would have to explain to the fan base that they were worried about Curry's ankle and, when approached with dowry the likes of Turner and Holiday, couldn't refuse in an attempt to make the team better. Holiday sure isn't Curry, but he isn't bad and he'll likely suit up for the whole season which will endear him to Dubs fans. Turner, meanwhile, restablishes the slashing isolation game that Golden State lost in the Ellis trade. It's not my favorite deal as a fan, but if Evan Turner can blow up into a franchise player, then everyone will be on board. He's one of a handful of players with that absolute superstar potential.

Then again, so is Curry. This deal hinges on your love for Turner versus your worries about SC30's ankle.

Thadeus Young

Probable asking price: Thaddeus Young and Lou Williams for David Lee and Charles Jenkins
Probable deal we'd get: Thaddeus Young for Dorrell Wright, Epke Udoh Trade Exception, Hawks 2012 2nd Round Pick
Prognosis: Red Light

I know he's a glue guy, I know he's versatile, and I know stats don't tell the whole story. But they tell part of it. And there's really no way you can spin a 12 and 5 guy as anything more than "nice". Young is something of a 3-4 tweener, he's a career 50% shooter who lacks 3-point range, but he's a physical clone of Dorrell Wright at 6'8", 220. This means the Warriors lose shooting range without getting bigger. And even if you want to make the undersized-but-tough argument, Young's big man numbers aren't that impressive either at 5 rebounds and less than 1 block per game.

Obviously, Philly is going to advertise Wright's breakout season a year ago and likely claim that the loss of his playmakers to injury and trade were to blame for his off-year. They'd also get a draft pick from Atlanta and Udoh's trade exception in this undeniable salary dump. Wright will be off the books in a couple of years, Young costs twice as much for double the years.

The Warriors will try to sell Young as this teams version of what Jeff Green did for OKC. At 7 million a pop, you'd better be sure you're sold on him as the starting 3, cause his contract is just as long as DLee's and the two of them alone will command nearly $20 million a season. Young's mentality and skill set fit into next year's Michael Malone-Andrew Bogut symphony, but after losing Ellis, I'd like to see the Warriors pursue a more offensive-minded player to man the wing position.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 7:28 pm
Since the 76ers play by committee, play as a team with noone really standing out, they have no player with a big value right now. Iguodala has less value than ever and Turner has just not produced anything major and his value is not as high as it was when he was drafted. Same thing for TYoung. Now is the time to get them as cheap as they'll ever be.

I think that DWright's expirer and the Spurs' late 1st rounder is enough to get either on of Young or Turner and to get Iguodala, throw in RJeff, maybe replace the late 1st rounder with the lottery pick if we get to keep it, or likely a trade can't be done for Iggy, unless the Sixers see him as expensive and giving nothing Turner, Young or someone else already there can give.

Thing with Iguodala is that he has a player option after next season, so really he could be a one year rental which is not what we're after. He would make for a great starting five, as well as a very expensive one and maybe would tkae that last year of his contract and likely sign an extension, but he is on 15 million next year and he really is not worth that, maybe 11-12 million that's it.

I think the Sixers would like to be players in free agency next offseason and for that, getting DWright thid offseason or even trading Iggy for DWright and RJeff, would allow them alot of options.


Really do think Philly could be an easy trading partner and get us a SF that is quite a bit better than the ones already here, and get for cheap too
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:01 pm
I would try to target Turner. Iguodala is too expensive as we have to resign our own players in the future and Lee has a long contract. Young is solid, but preferably we'd want someone who's a better slasher and facilitator. Turner is already a great rebounder and if he could play some point forward with the shooters we have and Lee, I think he would get better results than passing to Brand, and sub par jump shooters Iggy and Holliday. Plus he's a good defender.

I don't think his value is very high. Yes he was a #2 pick, but thus far, he hasn't proven much in this league. #2 picks like Marvin Williams and Hasheem Thabeet are examples of #2 picks who were still young but never had much trade value because they also didn't produce much.

I would offer Rush (s+t), Tyler, Spurs 1st and a 2nd for Turner and a 2nd or cash.

They would get Rush who is a solid fit for the role Collins wants from his SG, and is a solid defender who will look even better with perimeter defenders Iggy and Holliday around him. Tyler is a decent PF prospect so they get a big, plus the Spurs 1st can be used to acquire another big man in a deep draft either by standing pat or combining it with their own to move up and get their guy.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 8:16 pm
Yea, Turner is the best option of the three it seems, though not by much. He is not much of a distributor and certainly not like Iggy is at all. Turner is a pretty scorer at times, very good rebounder for his size (a real asset here that would be and give the team a pretty monstrous rebounding frontline) and also a pretty good defender. You get similar with Thaddeus Young as well.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 12, 2012 11:18 pm
migya wrote:Yea, Turner is the best option of the three it seems, though not by much. He is not much of a distributor and certainly not like Iggy is at all. Turner is a pretty scorer at times, very good rebounder for his size (a real asset here that would be and give the team a pretty monstrous rebounding frontline) and also a pretty good defender. You get similar with Thaddeus Young as well.


We don't need him to dish out 8+ assists per game, but we do need a scorer who can get into the lane. If he can do a drive and kick, with outside shooters like Klay and Curry his assists will go up. Right now he's pasisng to guys who aren't good jump shooters. Plus if he can run a pick and roll, Lee and Bogut are much better options than what he has in Philly.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 1:44 am
You look at Turner's stats and the guy looks like a bust, no exaggeration. His shooting percentages are awful, all of them and he doesn't score much.

I mentioned Turner (and the other two Philly SFs really) on potential only and that maybe he'd fit as the starting SF here
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 9:18 am
Yeah, I was gonna say, you know how I ripped Young for being a 12 and 5 guy...

Well, Turner's a 9 and 6 guy. And that 9's coming off a low 40 percentile from the floor. Dr Spaceman, you're probably right that we may be able to offer something closer to peanuts for him... But I dunno if I really want, hence my yellow light prognosis. Turner needs to turn a major corner before he can contribute in a truly meaningful way. We can get a facilitating rebound hound on the cheap with McGuire already; he can't shoot either but get this: he plays Rodman-esque defense!

I seriously think Turner might be a downgrade from what we have now. Seeing as "what we have" is a platoon of RJ-Dom-Dorrell-and Rush, that's saying something. Toss in his price tag and you've got a recipe for disappointment.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 10:20 am
I just think maybe Turner is very poorly used over there in Philly by coach Collins. He still has potential and looks like the hardnosed defender and rebounder type
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 12:10 pm
Which is strange because, traditionally, that's what Doug Collins likes: tough rebounders and defenders.

Maybe it's a bad fit, maybe he's being asked to do things he isn't capable of, but right now he's looking more and more like a smaller Ed O'Bannon; too slow to play the 2, too skinny to play bigger 3's, with a huge loss of confidence that's affecting his aggressiveness.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:16 pm
He was the 2nd pick two drafts ago and he is looking like a bust already
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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 5:44 am
Turner played well the last game yesterday, game 2 against Chicago. He has been awful since being drafted, but the guy has flashes of what he should be. Really would like to try to get him, heck him and Iguodala, in a trade. To be honest, I'd now send Klay, as well as the #7 and either AB or RJ for both those guys.
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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 8:15 am
Klay????
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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 2:16 pm
Evan Turner has been in the league 2 years. Not sure I would call him a bust just yet, especially if you look at that draft class. If you put him in a more high powered offense, this guy would contribute more both in points and assists to go with the rebounds. You look at his season averages and they're not that impressive, but he was used sparingly at the beginning of the season. In 4 games that he played 40+ minutes, they're 4-0. All 4 games came against playoff teams with one being in the playoffs. In those four games he's averaged 22 points, 11.7 rebounds and 5 assists. I wouldn't expect those kind of numbers throughout an entire season but if given 35+ minutes a game, I can see averages of 15 points, 8 rebounds and 4 assists.
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PostPosted: Wed May 02, 2012 3:16 pm
I think Klay has way more potential, the way he comes off screens, his sweet stroke, and he plays pretty good defense too. I don't know... I just don't see the intagiables in Turner that would make him better then Klay..... and Turner is going to have a bigger contract.
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