War Years wrote:

migya wrote:

bada wrote:Obviously there is a lot of trade talk from us fans on this board wanting to trade for a legitmate "big". Most of them involve Biedrins, Maggette, Morrow, etc and various combinations of the like.

However I think we need to realize that any of those are very unlikely. It is unrealistic to think we can trade for one of these "bigs" without giving up Curry, Monta our our high draft pick or most likely a combination of 2 of those.

I think most of us feel the one we for sure will not deal is Curry. This leaves Monta and/or our pick as our best chance to secure a legitimate post player. Monta alone will not do it.

I think the TWolves could be willing to give either AJefferson or Love, likely more AJefferson for something like AB and Azu or the lottery pick. It definately can be done as that franchise does some stupid things and has already tried to trade AJeff.

Monta could then be traded for something else, like trying to go for a SF, if Azu were to go or for another SG, replacing Monta. Maybe Gay could play SG here. A player that is more allround and bigger than Monta would be a much better fit

If we were trading our pick to the T-Wolves , that would mean the T-Wolves, as the standings are now, would be drafting 2nd, 3-6 ( our pick ), 24th,32nd, 42nd, and 46th. ( 6 picks) I think they'll be more apt to sell picks. Though it is a high pick.

That team will probably take all the talent they can get after the numerous seasons they've had losing so much. It's worth offering and I think they'd take it, as this draft class is supposed to be a good one. We don't need anymore rookies, as the team is so young as it is

Question everyone keeps forgetting how will Nellie use any type of post player ?

warriorsstepup wrote:Question everyone keeps forgetting how will Nellie use any type of post player ?

All this is relying on the fact that Nelson will be gone after this season and new owership takes over

if he's ever able to lift his arm over his head again, would love Bogurt. No chance in hell we land him though

Quazza wrote:if he's ever able to lift his arm over his head again, would love Bogurt. No chance in hell we land him though

Bogut was solid this season, but not a star by any means. He does what Centers should do, in rebounding, shotblocking and scoring down low well, but he is not that skilled, definately not the most among Centers

Migya, really man, gotta give up the dream of being able to trade Biedrins and Azubuike for Al Jefferson.

Yes, there have been some bad trades in the league before but there is just NO way this would happen.

I realize where this is coming from cause as you have correctly identified, we are DESPARATE for post help. Why are we desparate for post help? Because Biedrins is NOT cutting it. He cant score, is the worst FT shooter in NBA history, and does not defend well. The only thing he does rather well is rebound.

So based on this, Biedrins is a HUGE downgrade at center for the Wolves. So what is their "prize" for downgrading at the most difficult position in the NBA to fill? Azubuike????? Azubuike is a dime a dozen player. A player like him is the easiest to replace in the league. hell, you have already said in other threads that the play of Williams and Morrow make him expendable. We found his replacement in the d-league.... TWICE! Heck, even he came from the d-league. You think they will trade their best player for the 7th and 8th best players on one of the worst teams in the league?

Say we get the 5th or 6th pick in the draft. I dont think even adding that pick gets you Jefferson, although that is starting to become a bit more realistic.

To get a "star big" as you say, I think it will take a combination of 2 of the following 3:
Curry
Monta
our 1st round pick.

If that first round pick is a top 3 pick, then perhaps we could use that along with others like AR, Azu, etc

migya wrote:

Quazza wrote:if he's ever able to lift his arm over his head again, would love Bogurt. No chance in hell we land him though

Bogut was solid this season, but not a star by any means. He does what Centers should do, in rebounding, shotblocking and scoring down low well, but he is not that skilled, definately not the most among Centers

I actually think he's one of the most skilled big men in the game- great with both hands and is a fantastic passer

Quazza wrote:

migya wrote:

Quazza wrote:if he's ever able to lift his arm over his head again, would love Bogurt. No chance in hell we land him though

Bogut was solid this season, but not a star by any means. He does what Centers should do, in rebounding, shotblocking and scoring down low well, but he is not that skilled, definately not the most among Centers

I actually think he's one of the most skilled big men in the game- great with both hands and is a fantastic passer

Totally agree with you Quaz, Bogut has worked hard to live up to his hype.

What would I trade for bougut? my Klondike bar

bada wrote:Migya, really man, gotta give up the dream of being able to trade Biedrins and Azubuike for Al Jefferson.

Yes, there have been some bad trades in the league before but there is just NO way this would happen.

I realize where this is coming from cause as you have correctly identified, we are DESPARATE for post help. Why are we desparate for post help? Because Biedrins is NOT cutting it. He cant score, is the worst FT shooter in NBA history, and does not defend well. The only thing he does rather well is rebound.

So based on this, Biedrins is a HUGE downgrade at center for the Wolves. So what is their "prize" for downgrading at the most difficult position in the NBA to fill? Azubuike????? Azubuike is a dime a dozen player. A player like him is the easiest to replace in the league. hell, you have already said in other threads that the play of Williams and Morrow make him expendable. We found his replacement in the d-league.... TWICE! Heck, even he came from the d-league. You think they will trade their best player for the 7th and 8th best players on one of the worst teams in the league?

Firstly, let's be honest, maybe an AR/AB, PF/C duo could do quite well. This is going by what AB did before this awful season. 30mins each for those two, you could have AR averaging 10rebs & 2blks and AB averaging 10rebs & 1.5blks. That's just stats, but that also means production and some pretty good contribution from the PF & Center.

My point with that above, AB is productive and not the worst starting Center in the nba by a long shot. Coupling him with Love, Love being the PF, could be a very solid duo that rebounds and defends well, with Love being able to score much more. Maybe they keep Darko, who has played quite well, and they have a trio of bigs that rebound and defend well. With you saying AJefferson is actually a pretty bad defender (pretty sure it was you that said it), maybe the TWolves actually think they upgrade defensively.

Azu was not made expendable by either Morrow or Williams, at least in my opinion, and he has more ability right now than either of those two. I think Azu, a productive player that plays both ends and doesn't look like he has any weakness offensively, could fit in well with the likes of Flynn and CBrewer.

It is not a farfetched trade, not compared to many others I've seen the last few years. At least worth mentioning to the TWolves, who already shopped AJeff.

bada wrote:Say we get the 5th or 6th pick in the draft. I dont think even adding that pick gets you Jefferson, although that is starting to become a bit more realistic.

To get a "star big" as you say, I think it will take a combination of 2 of the following 3:
Curry
Monta
our 1st round pick.

If that first round pick is a top 3 pick, then perhaps we could use that along with others like AR, Azu, etc

Add in the lottery pick, top 2 or not and that is a coup for the TWolves, who need talent in a big way. Throw in the pick if needed.

I really think people think we have to sell the whole house to get talent, especially a talented big and we don't, just as other teams throughout the years haven't had to. You find a player that is being shopped and you know you don't have to pay too much, maybe you can't steal that player, but you have leverage in the knowledge that team is looking to get rid of that player.

If we can't get a star big without keeping Curry and AR, while not giving too much either, leave things alone then, much better than losing good players who will likely only get better.

There is always a way, you just have to ask around quietly

Quazza wrote:

migya wrote:

Quazza wrote:if he's ever able to lift his arm over his head again, would love Bogurt. No chance in hell we land him though

Bogut was solid this season, but not a star by any means. He does what Centers should do, in rebounding, shotblocking and scoring down low well, but he is not that skilled, definately not the most among Centers

I actually think he's one of the most skilled big men in the game- great with both hands and is a fantastic passer

I'm not that impressed by him. I haven't seen a heap of him, but have seen a fair bit and I think he is a prototypical Center, but isn't a star. He does what is required by a Center and that is rebound and block shots well, but he is not super at it, though is very good. He has to score more to be a real star big and finally get fully healthy, the real IF about him

migya wrote:Firstly, let's be honest, maybe an AR/AB, PF/C duo could do quite well. This is going by what AB did before this awful season. 30mins each for those two, you could have AR averaging 10rebs & 2blks and AB averaging 10rebs & 1.5blks. That's just stats, but that also means production and some pretty good contribution from the PF & Center.

Even at his peak, Biedrins was nowhere near the player Jefferson was or is. Now he is broken and as you said in another thread has an "undesirable contract". He has already said he has no confidence. And still has a ton of years and money left on his contract.

Migya wrote:My point with that above, AB is productive and not the worst starting Center in the nba by a long shot. Coupling him with Love, Love being the PF, could be a very solid duo that rebounds and defends well, with Love being able to score much more. Maybe they keep Darko, who has played quite well, and they have a trio of bigs that rebound and defend well. With you saying AJefferson is actually a pretty bad defender (pretty sure it was you that said it), maybe the TWolves actually think they upgrade defensively.

Jefferson is not a great defensive player. I think this is pretty much a wash.

migya wrote:Azu was not made expendable by either Morrow or Williams, at least in my opinion, and he has more ability right now than either of those two. I think Azu, a productive player that plays both ends and doesn't look like he has any weakness offensively, could fit in well with the likes of Flynn and CBrewer.

Azu is a decent player. But his is again a "dime a dozen" player. The draft every year is filled with wing players. Easiest position to replace. I think you are severly overvaluing Azu if you think they Wolves would downgrade significantly at Center in order to land Azubuike. That does not even take into account that he is coming off a severe knee injury.

migya wrote:It is not a farfetched trade, not compared to many others I've seen the last few years. At least worth mentioning to the TWolves, who already shopped AJeff.

yes, there have been worse on this board. I can agree with you there my friend!

migya wrote:I really think people think we have to sell the whole house to get talent, especially a talented big and we don't, just as other teams throughout the years haven't had to.

Um would really love to see these trades. Name me one star offensive post player that was traded in his prime for crap anywhere near this?

I think most people immediately will say the Gasol trade to the Lakers. But I think that was a deal that worked out for both teams. In that trade Memphis got:
Kwame Brown - a big expiring contract
Javaris Crittenton - a young and promising PG talent at the time
the rights to Marc Gasol - we have all seen what he has become. one of the best young Centers in the game.
Aaron Mckie - another expiring contract that they waived to clear cap space
and TWO 1st round draft picks

I think that is quite a haul they got for a player that was going to leave.

Anyway, please list these trades where a team essentially stole a star big in his prime

migya wrote:

Quazza wrote:

migya wrote:

Quazza wrote:if he's ever able to lift his arm over his head again, would love Bogurt. No chance in hell we land him though

Bogut was solid this season, but not a star by any means. He does what Centers should do, in rebounding, shotblocking and scoring down low well, but he is not that skilled, definately not the most among Centers

I actually think he's one of the most skilled big men in the game- great with both hands and is a fantastic passer

I'm not that impressed by him. I haven't seen a heap of him, but have seen a fair bit and I think he is a prototypical Center, but isn't a star. He does what is required by a Center and that is rebound and block shots well, but he is not super at it, though is very good. He has to score more to be a real star big and finally get fully healthy, the real IF about him

right now - he's better than your boy Al Jefferson

Quazza wrote:

migya wrote:

Quazza wrote:

migya wrote:

Quazza wrote:if he's ever able to lift his arm over his head again, would love Bogurt. No chance in hell we land him though

Bogut was solid this season, but not a star by any means. He does what Centers should do, in rebounding, shotblocking and scoring down low well, but he is not that skilled, definately not the most among Centers

I actually think he's one of the most skilled big men in the game- great with both hands and is a fantastic passer

I'm not that impressed by him. I haven't seen a heap of him, but have seen a fair bit and I think he is a prototypical Center, but isn't a star. He does what is required by a Center and that is rebound and block shots well, but he is not super at it, though is very good. He has to score more to be a real star big and finally get fully healthy, the real IF about him

right now - he's better than your boy Al Jefferson

Maybe, it is not clear.

Bogut is far more unattainable

Quazza wrote:

migya wrote:

Quazza wrote:

migya wrote:

Quazza wrote:if he's ever able to lift his arm over his head again, would love Bogurt. No chance in hell we land him though

Bogut was solid this season, but not a star by any means. He does what Centers should do, in rebounding, shotblocking and scoring down low well, but he is not that skilled, definately not the most among Centers

I actually think he's one of the most skilled big men in the game- great with both hands and is a fantastic passer

I'm not that impressed by him. I haven't seen a heap of him, but have seen a fair bit and I think he is a prototypical Center, but isn't a star. He does what is required by a Center and that is rebound and block shots well, but he is not super at it, though is very good. He has to score more to be a real star big and finally get fully healthy, the real IF about him

right now - he's better than your boy Al Jefferson

Um, actually right now Bogut may never play again. Let's say Bogut heals up and comes back good as new next season, he's no where near as good a low post scorer as Al Jefferson. He's a much better defender but not in the same class as a scorer.

Personally I'd much rather have Bogut than Jefferson (assuming both are healthy) but as Migya has mentioned Jefferson is far more obtainable than Bogut.

If Bogut does get back to normal then I'd be willing to trade big for him. He's exactly what the Warriors need.