mr. M. and mr. C.'s case

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 10:24 am
this rather personal thread, so if mods think it doesn't belong out there, please, feel free do do whatever you like about it.

in this thread i put myself in a trial, and as it is democratic rules that should apply to everyone in this forum, i want to make my case clear and carry out proper defense.
some of you, ladies and gentlemen, know that i've had some issues with a forum member by the name of coltraning. due to spacing, i since will use abreviation mr. C.
firstly, i'd like to start from the begining of the whole issue.
the way i see it, mr. C. didn't agree with my opinion on certain matters (corey maggette in this case) and implied that i haven't watched the basketball game he was watching and lived in a parallel universe. mind you, this is only because he didn't agree with my opinion.
when i tried to clear out the reasons of having an opinion i have. i was told that some word hasn't existed. i wasn't told any reasons why mr. C. thought he was right, except for the fact that he was a teacher at college. and this is a serious violation of argumentation. one cannot use argument at authority, if one is pursueing the truth and objectivity. for anyone not familiar with false argumentative techniques, please you can check http://www.don-lindsay-archive.org/skep ... ments.html , though i think simple use of one's reasoning abilities is enough to see that these types of argumentation are wrong. this i pointed out to mr. C. , as i felt it was my duty to say what is wrong with his statements. afterwards, i made some investigation and found out that the word (aesthetical) exists. (http://www.wordwebonline.com/en/AESTHETICAL , http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/aesthetical, http://www.thefreedictionary.com/aesthetical) i gave a link to the source. i knew i could've been wrong and would have admitted it as i've done numerous times in this land of yours, but i was right.
now, ladies and gentlemen, please think for yourselves and try to imagine how would you response to someone who accuses you of being wrong and does so in an argumentation which is false? and goes on with that even when he's shown the facts proving the case was different?
are you, being persons with self-respect and desire for fairness, not allowed to get a bit angry and feel bitter after these absurd charges?
i did, i used some harsh words regarding logic of argumentation mr. C. was using to bring the point home, though they all regarded his argumenation (which was wrong), not his personality. i even said, that i thought and will probably go on on thinking that mr. C. was interesting person in the first place, even after i was wrongly accused.
now, bear with me, i don't know why mr. C. uses this type or arguing - he could have been doing it because of habit he formed through his teaching years, he could have been doing it because of the desire to sound more reasonable than a person he addressed. there are other possibilities. yet, they are not strong enough to justify the injustice flames i found myself into after the initial argument.
yet, i stayed silent, i've met people who were wrong and felt hard to admit it. so i tried to go on without ever mentioning it. untill the next day person by forum name of 32 came bringing out the false accusation again and mr. C. wrote in his post that i was wrong and could not admit it!
ladies and gentlemen, say what you want, but it felt very uncalled for, unneccessary and made me mad. i gave the sources proving the existence of the particular word (aesthetical) again. tried to stay away from going into argument once more. i was made to feel wrong and, moreover, asked to change my mind and go with untruth! with all sincerity, how would that make you feel? you are asked to admit you're are wrong (when the case is opposite) and feel regret about being right and fighting for truth, justice and equal rights? i think you may answer for yourselves.
now, everyone can understand in what a mess this whole situation left me. i decided to stay away from mr. C.
untill. well i was litteraly called falling out of number of any reasonable men and accused of using bush policies! how about that for an argument?
let me translate what that implies - mr. M. is an idiot, irrational, ignorant and politacally insane. what left me more amazed was the fact that it was done very consciously and with aparent intent, for to make his argument valid the forum member by the name of Coltraning used another forum person to add to his argument. this is wrong argumentation all over again, and everyone feel free to study the techniques of logical fallacy to see what i'm getting at.
my anger was doubled. i responded using some harsher words and admitted in the same post that i'm doing it knowing i'm wrong (in talking like that). i tried to make a point that insults don't have to come in swearing, masked ones may be even more painful and untrue.
please, if anyone of you came to this point and not fell asleep, follow me for several more lines. i never called mr. C.'s personality into doubt, i just questioned his argumentation. i used some anger driven words, for that is how most normal human beings on this planet would respond to false accusations, the untrue, unjust and egalitarian. maybe i went over the line in my style and word, but certainly not in spirit.
now, the last point in defense of mr. M. (a frorum member by the name of Martin). Mr. C. came up by calling me 'homey' and 'ignorant' and 'unworthy of dealing with'. these are direct insults and far more harsh that i ever came up with regarding the personality of mr. C. or , for that case, any member of this forum. what is more blatantly atrocious - mr. C. came up calling authorities to judge mr. M. , suggesting mr. M. to be expelled from the land of goldenstwarriors.com!
ladies and gentlemen, my defense is coming to end, but i want to give you a picture of the situation as i see it.
imagine you having a neighbour with whom you don't agree on a value of a certain car. imagine yourself expressing it and being called unreasonable because of your opinion (in defense of which you provided arguments), then being accused of being wrong in a case where you were right and having a stick up in your yard with saying - 'mr. X. is wrong, because i said so', imagine yourself trying to take it (the stick) out from your yard and being accused of violating laws regarding private property. and in the end imagine being given out to police with suggestion of terminating your right to free speech, equality, defense, private property and accused of hooliganism. while everything you did was defending (sometimes harshly) truth (which is your biggest value) and democracy.
now, ladies and gentlemen, how would you feel and react?

this is my case laid out in front of your eyes, you may check the posts i was refering to and investigate the links i provided. i stand true to my opinion (on corey maggette and jamal crawford) and never try to ridicule else's. i stand true to my belief of pursuit for truth, justice and equality. which is the biggest value i have ever known and feel justified to defend.

i spent many hours trying to solve this case and preparing the defense against false accusations. i hope at least some of you have the time, patience and will to help this situation be sorted out.

if you think i'm wrong, i will immediately leave this land, for it would mean i have different value system and democratic principles than you and i don't belong in this country.

if you decide i was right and justified in my arguments and goal, i think it would be fair enough to conclude that Coltraning owes me an apology and a couple shots of virtual whiskies.

thank you in advance for your time and energy.

now, while you make up your mind, please, enter javanese court gamelan:



[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3vezWaMh3M0[/youtube]
Last edited by martin on Wed Jan 14, 2009 10:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 10:31 am
Only thing I'm gonna say is that we're already dealing with this in the mods forum.

Which means we'll keep an eye on this thread, but won't post in it unless it's to keep it under control (if needed, which I hope won't be the case).
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 10:33 am
First off, I like you being here Martin.
I honestly don't have an opinion on the whole thing except: Whatever problem you have with Mr. C can be worked out between the two of you. And I hope that happens....
You both are intelligent and amiable, both positives for this forum.


When I get done with my work day today, I'll try to come back and read the novel above and give you a more in depth opinion...


but that's my 2cents on the fly so to speak...
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 11:03 am
I couldnt agree with Jack more... Both u Martin and Coltraning are excellent contributers, and also are great observers when it comes to watching the game..

Its funny, cuz the first time i responded to Quazza, it was a little like the exchange of you two. i got angry at his rationale, and was like WTF, this cat cant be serious. But the dude is one of the funniest people on the board and is always fun to talk to on the chat thing during the game.

My point is, both you two have a similar approach of writing and similar insight. Somethings one should remember is that when one see's something, it is of the eye of the beholder. Thats why this is an "opinion", and we are all entitled to our thoughts.

To quote the Quazmeister on how are argument ended:
"We should agree to disagree", and leave it like that.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 2:35 pm
I see both you and colt insightful members of the forum. The more opinions the better, and both of you have well thought out postings. Sometimes it takes different ideas to help a person looking from the outside see a the full subject that's being debated. Sometimes we need to absorb what others are saying and try and see the point they are making, if a person disagrees, then they can argue their point i don't see nothing wrong with that.

The 2 of you are probably more alike than you think. Both of you have an in depth understanding of philosophy, both are on the board for the same reason to support the warriors, both of you seem like very intelligent people, with strong opinions, with that the butting of heads. You should not let arguments on the board get up your skin( though easier said than done).
You both should be reasonable in how you approach each other try not to aggravate your selves.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 3:39 pm
Mr. Crackerz wrote:I couldnt agree with Jack more... Both u Martin and Coltraning are excellent contributers, and also are great observers when it comes to watching the game..

Its funny, cuz the first time i responded to Quazza, it was a little like the exchange of you two. i got angry at his rationale, and was like WTF, this cat cant be serious. But the dude is one of the funniest people on the board and is always fun to talk to on the chat thing during the game.

My point is, both you two have a similar approach of writing and similar insight. Somethings one should remember is that when one see's something, it is of the eye of the beholder. Thats why this is an "opinion", and we are all entitled to our thoughts.

To quote the Quazmeister on how are argument ended:
"We should agree to disagree", and leave it like that.


awwww, *heart* Crack

;)

In all seriousness though, Crack's spot on. People clash on this board, as we are all here for the same reason-Passion. Passion for the Warriors brings us to this site, period. And when you have a board full of passionate people, there's going to be little flare ups and yup, plenty of disagreements. You can go back and forth, back and forth with someone, but often all it needs is someone just to bite the bullet and walk away, and in the end, all parties involved will be better off for it

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 3:45 pm
i see what you say, guys, and i understand all of it.
the thing that made me create this thread was colts suggestion for mods to do an investigation on me!
this was totally crazy in my eyes.
well, if you read this long talk, you'd understand my point.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 5:47 pm
just ban both and be done with it :shock:
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 7:35 pm
Quazza wrote:
Mr. Crackerz wrote:I couldnt agree with Jack more... Both u Martin and Coltraning are excellent contributers, and also are great observers when it comes to watching the game..

Its funny, cuz the first time i responded to Quazza, it was a little like the exchange of you two. i got angry at his rationale, and was like WTF, this cat cant be serious. But the dude is one of the funniest people on the board and is always fun to talk to on the chat thing during the game.

My point is, both you two have a similar approach of writing and similar insight. Somethings one should remember is that when one see's something, it is of the eye of the beholder. Thats why this is an "opinion", and we are all entitled to our thoughts.

To quote the Quazmeister on how are argument ended:
"We should agree to disagree", and leave it like that.


awwww, *heart* Crack

;)

In all seriousness though, Crack's spot on. People clash on this board, as we are all here for the same reason-Passion. Passion for the Warriors brings us to this site, period. And when you have a board full of passionate people, there's going to be little flare ups and yup, plenty of disagreements. You can go back and forth, back and forth with someone, but often all it needs is someone just to bite the bullet and walk away, and in the end, all parties involved will be better off for it



You two said it exactly right. This is nothing more than a little dispute between two very intelligent and insightful individuals that needs to end and everyone move on as this is just a waste of energy, energy and time that both of these men can use much better and always do in fact, going by what they say on this forum
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:44 am
migya wrote:You two said it exactly right. This is nothing more than a little dispute between two very intelligent and insightful individuals that needs to end and everyone move on as this is just a waste of energy, energy and time that both of these men can use much better and always do in fact, going by what they say on this forum


Yep, that's my take as well. I just don't see anything so terrible as to deserve a banishment, or even a warning. Just a disagreement between two good and valuable members that must be solved between them.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 12:40 pm
Mr C really doesn't care, Mr. M...life is way too short to deal with such silliness, so think and say whatever you want, Mr. M, Mr C will leave to the mods to decide whether cursing at someone on the board is cool. Mr C is done with this. If Mr M wants to talk basketball, all good.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 3:28 pm
mr. M. doesn't see why the heck mods should be into this in the first place.
and mr. M. doesn't get why mr. C. cannot admit being wrong and mistaken.
but, well, mr. M. steps aside.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:21 pm
get a room you two ::lol:
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:28 pm
8th ave wrote:get a room you two ::lol:


I don't think you'd like to see what would happen in that room, dude. ::lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 15, 2009 4:43 pm
TMC wrote:
8th ave wrote:get a room you two ::lol:


I don't think you'd like to see what would happen in that room, dude. ::lol:


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