Spurs 3 HoF'ers???

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PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 4:39 pm
Manu is an elite player and is one of the best that ever played.
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PostPosted: Fri May 10, 2013 9:44 pm
When I said Ginobili is top 15 in his era, I meant from players that started playing from 200 onwards. Most of the players 32 mentioned a few posts above are better than Ginobili and had better careers, but yes, most were always the main guy on their teams. I do agree that Ginobili, when he was younger, would have done similar to what Harden has done this season, being the number one player on his team. Ginobili isn't about number totals as much as he's about effectiveness and apparently some of these advanced stats show that, though truth is I know very little about these advanced stats as they are relatively new and I never really studied them.
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migya make the ring fall on ya

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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 12:26 am
migya wrote:When I said Ginobili is top 15 in his era, I meant from players that started playing from 200 onwards. Most of the players 32 mentioned a few posts above are better than Ginobili and had better careers, but yes, most were always the main guy on their teams. I do agree that Ginobili, when he was younger, would have done similar to what Harden has done this season, being the number one player on his team. Ginobili isn't about number totals as much as he's about effectiveness and apparently some of these advanced stats show that, though truth is I know very little about these advanced stats as they are relatively new and I never really studied them.


Super easy to understand.

Basketball-reference is a good start.
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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 1:29 pm
Blackfoot wrote:Manu is an elite player and is one of the best that ever played.

Completely disagree. Manu Ginobli is the absolute picture of a B-level player; a #3 option on a great team. Those players do not belong in the hall-of-fame. I think the highest honor Ginobli deserves after he retires is his jersey retired by the Spurs. He was a great player for them; not in the grand scheme of the games of basketball. To call Manu Ginobli one of the most elite shooting guards of all-time is a slap in the face to the 30 SG's that had better careers than him; many of whom are not in the hall-of-fame.

Your Harden example is exactly true. I believe Ginobli, as the #1 player on another team, would put up much better individual numbers and get tossed outta the post-season in the first round every year until they got a better player than him. I used to have this exact same argument regarding Tracy McGrady.
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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 1:52 pm
32 wrote:
Blackfoot wrote:Manu is an elite player and is one of the best that ever played.

Completely disagree. Manu Ginobli is the absolute picture of a B-level player; a #3 option on a great team. Those players do not belong in the hall-of-fame. I think the highest honor Ginobli deserves after he retires is his jersey retired by the Spurs. He was a great player for them; not in the grand scheme of the games of basketball. To call Manu Ginobli one of the most elite shooting guards of all-time is a slap in the face to the 30 SG's that had better careers than him; many of whom are not in the hall-of-fame.

Your Harden example is exactly true. I believe Ginobli, as the #1 player on another team, would put up much better individual numbers and get tossed outta the post-season in the first round every year until they got a better player than him. I used to have this exact same argument regarding Tracy McGrady.


In fairness to McGrady, his prime was only three years. And it was absolutely a better prime than Kobe. It was just super short.

Depends if you think that three years of absolute crazy good basketball is worth hall of fame.
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PostPosted: Sun May 12, 2013 4:23 pm
With the comparison to Harden and getting out in the 1st round. Get a couple of pretty good players around him, replace Lin is one as he is not that good, and Harden and his team could be a contender, with him as their best player. Same thing for Ginobili, in his prime, not now as I think he is going to start regressing.
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PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2013 1:04 am
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... Y7lMkMbImQ
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 1:11 pm
Thought I'd bump this since Ginobli has been such an integral part of the Spurs success this post-season.[/sarcasm] Dude's shooting percentages are lower than whale sh*t right now. 39% from the field in the playoffs? 29% for three? Playing like a true hall-of-famer, yessir...

Better issue here: if the Spurs win tonight, Duncan's at 5 rings. And suddenly he's no longer in merely "the best PF" convo with Barkley and Malone; he's in the mix for GREATEST BIG MAN OF ALL-TIME. You gotta suddenly look at Duncan in the same context as Kareem, Russell, O'Neal, and Chamberlain. That's ELITE company and I'm not saying we won't view Duncan with those guys ANYWAY (5th ring or no), but I'll tell you one thing: winning 5 rings in the smallest market any of those bigs played in, without a superman sidekick like Kobe or Magic or Jerry West or Sam Jones... it makes Duncan very possibly the greatest 7-footer to ever have played the game of basketball.

And this is coming from a converted Duncan-hater who credited the Spurs' management and the implosion of the post-Jordan era on much of Duncan's success. Not anymore, bro. I'm a believer and I honestly think, with another 2 or 3 seasons in him, if Duncan catches 5 or 6 rings before he hangs them up, it'll be Duncan above the rest. How could it not be?
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PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 4:05 pm
He has been bad, but that doesn't change my opinion on him. He's old. I am not going to give Dwade **** for a bad playoffs either, his knee is **** right now. Both hall of famers in my opinion who have been detrimental to their teams in the post season.

I don't think he can pass O'neal and Kareem(Duncan) and Russel and Wilt came from different eras which makes it difficult to judge.

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PostPosted: Thu Jun 20, 2013 7:32 pm
Remember, the Hall of Fame is not just NBA but all of basketball as a whole. Manu played 6 seasons in Europe before the NBA. PLUS, he plays international every season. Dude is a baller. He isnt a HOF if he doesn't win rings. But he has 3 (maybe 4 by the end of tonight).

Its close.

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PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2013 2:06 am
Ginobili smh, was playing out of control the last 2 games, costly costly errors on his part.
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 21, 2013 11:18 am
Mr. Crackerz wrote:Remember, the Hall of Fame is not just NBA but all of basketball as a whole. Manu played 6 seasons in Europe before the NBA. PLUS, he plays international every season. Dude is a baller. He isnt a HOF if he doesn't win rings. But he has 3 (maybe 4 by the end of tonight).

Its close.

But do they win those rings because of HIM, or because he's next to - arguably - the best big man ever?

I'm not even saying take Duncan out of the equation entirely; I'm saying give Ginobli a sidekick big man; give him a Tyson Chandler or an Andrew Bogut or a Marc Gasol. Does he EVER win a ring with them instead of Duncan? I don't think so.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 7:25 am
Ginobili played better the last two games of the finals, but overall he was not much of a factor and his career is close to the end.

As for him maybe not getting any ring if not for Duncan, same thing could be said for Pippen if he didn't have Jordan. Is he not a HOFer for that reasoning?

Ginobili has done enough and is a player whose numbers haven't given him justice in his career.
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:50 pm
Mediocre player; not great, but good. Perfect situation to be in so that fans can try and justify his value.

People would be saying the same crap about Richard Jefferson if he were in Ginobli's shoes...
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 6:57 pm
I would be saying the same things about Ginobli like I have been now even if he had no rings and never played in the playoffs.
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