New renderings of the SF arena

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PostPosted: Sun May 05, 2013 1:27 pm
http://www.nba.com/warriors/sf?venue

We've already talked about this before a long time ago but I don't feel like digging it up.

Breaks my heart that they're leaving. You see what kind of environment the Oracle brings and you just have to question whether or not if the new SF arena will bring the same energy.

Venue Seating Capacity: 17,500. For reference, the capacity of Oracle Arena is 19,596


Also have to think about the cost of the tickets. New arena + fewer seating, you'd assume that ticket prices will be significantly higher. Will it be more difficult for your average Joe to attend a game? Will the environment become more "corporate"? Will the games be filled with more people with business suits entertaining their clients? Will we have more celebrities at the games and have the focus go from your enthusiastic fan to celebs like Spike Lee, Billy Crystal, and Jack Nicholson?

Parking Spaces: approximately 630. Piers 30-32 currently parks 1,500 cars


This is joke. It really is. For comparison, Oracle has 10,000 spaces. Driving to the games is no longer an option. Taking the Bart is the only way to get to the game. Geographically, it'll be more convenient for people in SF and people in SF only. You look at a map and you start to wonder whether or not if people from Livermore, Walnut Creek, Concord, San Ramon, Fremont, Union City, or just people from the greater east bay area will attend the games anymore. Sure you can take the Bart, but with games starting at 7:30 and ending at 10:00, you wonder how much longer it would take from them to get home, especially on those work/business days.

You also have to think about people from South San Francisco, San Mateo, and the South Bay as well. Sure, the distance between them and the arena gets closer, but you're not on the bart line and do you really want to drive into the parking dilemma that is San Francisco?

Ughhh. I'm sad.

I would've loved for them to build an arena in the Jack London area. That could revive the entire fukking city!
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 1:03 pm
I'm South Bay and the Bart line doesn't worry me cause there's a connection at Milbrae off Caltrain (which is what I take to Giants games anyway). Even then, the arena is a couple blocks from AT&T Park, so even if I didn't wanna buy a Bart ticket to get there, I could walk from Caltrain and it wouldn't kill me.

Regarding the "corporate" crowd thing... I hope it does get more corporate. It doesn't keep any of us out of AT&T Park; just pumps more money into the product. That means 2 of the past 3 World Series titles, plus 30K worth of giveaways at half the home games, to go along with a whole other level of park experience (if you haven't been there, I recommend you head that way for a Giants-A's interleague game. The Coliseum is like Candlestick; I respect the history, but you can't beat a 21st century venue). Again, the prices don't keep me out. I run a deal with my girlfriend; one of us buys the tickets (I like to buy the $130 ones 20 rows behind home plate... it's an occasion; we only do 3 or 4 games a season, so I drop $300 on seats) and the other buys the train tickets and food and beers (aka, her). If you're a mom with a pile of kids, buy bleacher seats on the cheap (who wastes premium tickets on children anyway? My parents NEVER took me to a game in the lower deck when I was a youngster; they started buying lower level season tickets to Warriors games after me and my brother left home).

Bottom line is that these days, with marketing and advertising and all the money it takes to run a successful sports team, a big market matters. Sure, we can catch lightening in a bottle (ala "We Believe") in a medium/small market, but the teams perennially on top with the big budgets in all 3 major sports are from Boston, LA, New York, Miami, Chicago, and Dallas... AND San Francisco. We're the 4th largest market in the country, the 2nd largest in the Western conference; the Pacific coast equivalent to Boston. Look at SF: in the past 3 years, there's been 2 World Series, a SuperBowl appearance, and an NFC title game. Oakland has not gotten to a league championship in a major sport since the A's were swept in the AL Championship series in 2006. It was the 2nd time they'd reached that plateau since 1991. The A's last title was 1989, the Raiders was 1983, the Warriors was 1975. That makes the average time since Oakland's last major title 31 years. The Giants have 2 of the last 3; the 49ers were in the SuperBowl this year and last won a title in 1994.

- By the way, if we wanna get technical, the 2 home games the Warriors played in the NBA Finals in 1975 were in the Cow Palace (aka, San Francisco). So the Warriors have technically never celebrated a title in Oakland. -

I feel for the tenants of Oakland, I really do. But it could be a lot worse. A LOT worse. Ask Seattle. Oakland isn't losing their franchise; they are simply taking their turn as the ones who have to commute. They haven't had to for 40 years, so I understand that it's a shock. But it's doable. The rest of us non-East Bay residents do it, no problem. You can too.

And if you're a real, honest Warriors fan... this is huge. This is the single best thing one team can do to improve everything about the quality of their product. The payroll will increase, the roster will become elite, the team will compete regularly, there will be no more decades without playoff basketball... there's literally no downside to this move. I can't wait for it to happen.
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 2:27 pm
I just don't know, bro. Maybe it wouldn't be a hassle for people in the south bay, but won't you agree that the problem for the greater east bay area still exist? Sure, maybe people in south San Francisco won't have any issues getting to the games, but if you're east or south of Oakland, I think it becomes relatively more difficult to go to Warriors game, especially on a weekday where games end at 10, and after taking the bart, plus driving home if you had to drive to the bart station takes a lot of time, no? Think of places like Hayward, Fremont, Newark, Livermore, San Ramon, Castro Valley, the list goes on and on. I don't think there's a way to deny that Oakland is a much more central location than San Francisco.

When I talk about a corporate setting I'm more worried about the enthusiasm that you could potentially lose from the crowd. I don't keep up with the Niners and Giants, so what are the crowds like? Is it comparable to Seattle? I'm using the Seahawks as an example because I saw a segment saying that they were the best fans in football or something like that. This is important to me because the Oracle draw such great crowds, arguably the best fans in the NBA. In the grand scheme of things, this probably doesn't mean much overall, but I'm damn proud of the crowds that we've pumped out the last 2 decades of turmoil, and losing the environment/enthusiasm that the Oracle provides would be such a shame, wouldn't you agree?

Also, doesn't a corporate setting jack up the price of tickets too? Less overall seats + more season tickets being bought out by companies further lessening the available seats. Wouldn't this make the prices of tickets go up as the amount of tickets decrease and the demand goes up?

I've been doing research on "big markets". Can someone tell me what constitutes a big market? I've read a couple of articles and I see LA, Chicago, and Boston get brought up a lot, but what constitutes a big market doesn't seem to be consistent. Does it have mostly to do with Basketball Related Income?
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 4:29 pm
Regarding the crowd noise, no, the 49ers do not have a louder crowd than the Seahawks. Not even close. But they have a louder crowd than the Raiders. And the Giants have a louder crowd than the A's; that one's not even close. In fact, a recent poll of MLB players credited SF as the 2nd "most obnoxious crowd", behind Philly and ahead of NY. That means the SF crowd is wearing out whatever team that comes to play against them.

http://abclocal.go.com/wpvi/story?secti ... id=8700568

Either way, it's sort of a moot point because the Bay Area market is split between 2 teams. The Seahawks have an infinitely larger region to market their team to. The Warriors are similar to that; it's the only team in the Bay, so it corners every person in the hardcore sports fan demographic. Half of the people on Warriors sites back the Giants, half back the A's. The Warriors get all those fans. So I'm not worried about the booming Roaracle crowd transferring to SF; especially since Lacob told us (at a season ticket holders meeting, so no link) that half of the season ticket holders in Oracle hail from across the Bay. A ton of the noise at these Warriors home games are coming from us San Jose and San Francisco residents, too, along with the East Bay locals. The crowd won't suffer. If the Giants are any indication, it'll actually get louder.

I feel you on the commute thing, dude. I really do. Because its the exact situation I'm currently enduring. I have to leave for Warriors games 2.5 hours ahead of time. 880 is hell; it's always stopped at McCarthy's Ranch and all through Fremont. So, yeah, if I have work til 7, I can't get to a Warriors game. And the East Bay fans will have to deal with that in 2017. It sucks, but it's just reality. And the real fans fight through it. I gotta travel an hour or more to go to Warriors, Giants, and Niners games. Sure, the Shark Tank is right around the corner, but I only watch real sports so I could care less about watching Canada's national past time. I've only ever known commuting to an arena as part of going to a sports game. You get through it.

There will be tickets for everybody, bro. Nosebleeds won't be $200. Sure, you might not be able to sit courtside for 5 games a year. But modern stadiums take architecture into account and there's not a bad seat at AT&T Park. The new Warriors stadium will be dope. Trust me, bro.

Don't you think the rendered photos look sick?? There's gonna be a view of the bridge from inside the arena?!? That's the coolest f*cking thing I've ever seen.
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 4:31 pm
I was just about to post this! Did you see that view of the bridge from inside of the arena? That is sick!! This is going to be a world class arena! No other city can even dream of this. We should put our emotions aside. This will be the San Francisco version of the Oracle. It will still be plenty loud. The Giants fans are some of the loudest in all of baseball, so there is absolutely no reason why the impact Oracle has won't transfer. This is the best looking arena I have ever seen. Trust me, there will be a lot of bandwagon people from SF that starts rooting for us! Trust in Lacob. The memories of Oracle were nice, but let's win some championships! SF is going to officially make us a big market team! This is a dream stadium.
Last edited by Stairway Man on Mon May 06, 2013 4:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 4:31 pm
And "big markets" don't refer to anything regarding the team; it's just the financial industry of the area. There's a LOT of money changing hands in SF. That means a lot of potential revenue for ANY business that moves there; of which sports teams top the charts.
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 4:39 pm
32 wrote:And "big markets" don't refer to anything regarding the team; it's just the financial industry of the area. There's a LOT of money changing hands in SF. That means a lot of potential revenue for ANY business that moves there; of which sports teams top the charts.



32, while we feel for the people, don't you think that by looking at the BIG PICTURE, this is a big upgrade? I'm ecstatic about this! We are going to have the best nba arena in the world and perhaps the best team! Tons of national recognition will follow!

I understand people from the East Bay will miss their arena, but at least they are moving to a world class city to an amazing spot. I mean, we're gonna be potential contenders for the long haul with this move! It's all a good thing!!!
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 5:05 pm
Just so hard for me to come to grips with.

If they change the name to SF warriors, I probably won't be a dubs fan anymore. I know it sounds irrational as hell, but to me it's a back hand to Oakland fans who hosted this Warriors squad for 3 decades. Sooner or later, I just have to put my big boy pants on and suck it up, but if they make that name change, that'll be my last days following the NBA.
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 5:52 pm
Stairway Man wrote:
32 wrote:And "big markets" don't refer to anything regarding the team; it's just the financial industry of the area. There's a LOT of money changing hands in SF. That means a lot of potential revenue for ANY business that moves there; of which sports teams top the charts.



32, while we feel for the people, don't you think that by looking at the BIG PICTURE, this is a big upgrade? I'm ecstatic about this! We are going to have the best nba arena in the world and perhaps the best team! Tons of national recognition will follow!

I understand people from the East Bay will miss their arena, but at least they are moving to a world class city to an amazing spot. I mean, we're gonna be potential contenders for the long haul with this move! It's all a good thing!!!

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=10117

I was the main proponent of the pro side towards the move in that original thread regarding this subject. I am STOKED for the move. Better commute for me personally, but bipartisanly it will add clout, payroll flexibility, better food, better seats, better product. EVERYTHING will improve. The Warriors will take their rightful place among the perennial contenders that feature team's situated in the biggest markets. The Lakers, Knicks, and Celtics are comparably storied franchises. If Atlanta goes through a similar transformation, the storied franchises will all be upgraded.

And 8th... I really just don't agree with that last statement. The Warriors are not Oakland's team; they belong to all of us. Jumping ship because of a move or a name change just doesn't make sense to me. I'm not pissed that the Niners are moving to Santa Clara. Why does it matter where the Bay Area's basketball team plays its home games? The team belongs to ALL of us in the Bay. Not just Oakland, bro. All of us. We all buy tickets and jerseys and merch'.
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 6:07 pm
Wutchu talkin' about, bruh? Ain't nobody said it was Oakland's team. I'm just sayin' it'll be fuked up if they changed the name to SF Warriors because that's like disowning the city that kept the ship afloat for 30 years. San Francisco Niners will still be San Francisco Niners. It'll be a different story if they changed the name to San Mateo Niners, wouldn't it?
Last edited by 8th ave on Mon May 06, 2013 6:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 6:12 pm
8th ave wrote:Just so hard for me to come to grips with.

If they change the name to SF warriors, I probably won't be a dubs fan anymore. I know it sounds irrational as hell, but to me it's a back hand to Oakland fans who hosted this Warriors squad for 3 decades. Sooner or later, I just have to put my big boy pants on and suck it up, but if they make that name change, that'll be my last days following the NBA.



8th Ave, yes it is irrational in my opinion. You just have to look at the bright side. I mean for us over in SF, we were still fans all this time when the arena was in Oakland. And so, since the Warriors are the bay areas team, it just seems a little greedy of you to only root for the Warriors if they are on your side of the bay. And it has nothing to do with enjoying basketball. The owners have made it clear. That wherever you are in the bay, this is the whole entire bay area's team. So you are welcome to still be a fan and should be. They are still the team of the whole bay area just like how it's always been. The only difference is that now they will be in the most iconic spot in the world and will be nationally recognized. If I were you, I would be enthralled and stoked completely. What's the difference? Why would this stop you from watching the NBA? It does seem a bit irrational to me. Seems like you have too much pride in the arena staying in Oakland. Yes, the Oracle has a loud atmosphere. But, we never won in Oakland regardless. Sort of like all those fans who booed at Lacob for trading Monta Ellis. But, it was the right move. And this is certainly a no brainer. I would embrace this move if I were you. The owners know what they are doing. So what if transportation and tickets cost becomes a little bit more of a hassle. We are going to win championships and be a top NBA market with the worlds most iconic NBA arena! This is huge! You'll get over it. I have faith you will. I understand where you're coming from. But nothing has changed in a negative way. We're still the Warriors.
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 6:20 pm
If the warriors keeps it's name as Golden State, I'm in. They change that thing to SF warriors I will no longer be riding this ship.
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PostPosted: Mon May 06, 2013 11:11 pm
It would suck if they drop Golden State.
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PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2013 3:25 am
8th ave wrote:If the warriors keeps it's name as Golden State, I'm in. They change that thing to SF warriors I will no longer be riding this ship.



Why not? If they were Oakland now, I'd ride. Who you gonna root for then? I actually find that an insult to SF. What's wrong with SF?
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PostPosted: Tue May 07, 2013 10:14 am
8th ave wrote:I'm just sayin' it'll be fuked up if they changed the name to SF Warriors because that's like disowning the city that kept the ship afloat for 30 years.

This is what I'm talking about.

Oakland did not "keep the ship afloat" for 30 years.

It was ALL OF US in the Bay.

Considering the sheer number of season ticket holders from outside of the East Bay, its not unreasonable to think the Warriors would have been moved or sold to OKC entrepreneurs without the support of the entire Bay Area. This is exactly what I meant in the old thread when I said Oakland was taking unrightful ownership of a team that didn't belong solely to them; it belongs to all of us. If they moved the Washington Monument from DC to Virginia, is it not still an American landmark?

Sorry, bro. There's a thin red line between understandably bummed that the arena is no longer around the corner and sounding grandiose as if no one else in the Bay has a right to the team. Jumping ship because the team might be associated with San Francisco instead of Oakland for the first time in 40 years reenforces the idea that Oakland natives are pretending this team belongs to them instead of the entire Bay. I agree with Stairway here. He's from SF, I'm from SJ. We have no qualms rooting for the team when it's heavily associated with the city of Oakland. Why would Oakland residents resent our hometowns in a similar situation? To me, I don't care if the damn team moves to San Bruno or Pleasanton or Concord or Santa Cruz or Dublin or Livermore... I could absolutely care less ,as long as it's still in the Bay Area and not moving to Vegas or Seattle. Gimmie a top-flight, first-class arena ANYWHERE in the Bay Area and I'm happy.
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