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PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 8:40 pm
The big difference between Barnes and Williams in their rookie seasons is the players they had around them. Barnes seems unselfish and reluctant to look for his shot when he has Curry, Thompson and Lee demanding the ball. Apart from Joe Johnson, Williams didn't have much talent around him and he was expected to score given that he was 2nd pick in the draft.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:02 pm
Ringo wrote:The big difference between Barnes and Williams in their rookie seasons is the players they had around them. Barnes seems unselfish and reluctant to look for his shot when he has Curry, Thompson and Lee demanding the ball. Apart from Joe Johnson, Williams didn't have much talent around him and he was expected to score given that he was 2nd pick in the draft.

This. I've been saying that all season long. Harrison has a lot of options on offense playing alongside him, so he couldn't shoot as much. He's gonna be real good, just wait.
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 23, 2013 10:20 pm
Guybrush wrote:
Ringo wrote:The big difference between Barnes and Williams in their rookie seasons is the players they had around them. Barnes seems unselfish and reluctant to look for his shot when he has Curry, Thompson and Lee demanding the ball. Apart from Joe Johnson, Williams didn't have much talent around him and he was expected to score given that he was 2nd pick in the draft.

This. I've been saying that all season long. Harrison has a lot of options on offense playing alongside him, so he couldn't shoot as much. He's gonna be real good, just wait.

He has all the tools. I just hope he puts them together.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 1:41 am
On Barnes - The guy has all the tools to be an allstar caliber player at least. When he was in high school, he was touted as the greatest player at that level and already had a great outside shot. In college, he was a marksman and his outside shot was said to be beyond nba ready. He has shown this season that he is capable of not being the man, not being the fitst option and that is a nice humble trait. Right now he is the sixth or seventh option offensively when the team is fully healthy, as I think Bogut is even ahead of him offensively as option. Barnes has handled the ball better than expected and has rebounded quite well in his time. He will develop and improve everything and become likely fourth or third option next season. I'm so happy that we have him, especially when very easily we could have missed out on him. He filled the biggest position of need.

The team has got to resign both Jack and Landry, but both will likely be offered a bit more money than what they're on now. It'd be great to be able to trade both AB and RJ for no salary in return, but that's very unlikely. That'd give the FO some 21 million extra to play with and that in itself would certainly allow for the signing of a difference maker, not that the team really needs one with what they've already got. Jack will be very hard to replace I think, with what he gives and allowing Curry to play off the ball quite a bit. There are other bigs that could replace Landry, heck, imagine being able to at least get rid of one of AB or RJ and not get any salary in return, that'd allow for the signing of JSmith of Atlanta for what he's on now, who'd make a great 6th man.

Even if the team can't get rid of one or both aB and RJ, they should pay luxury tax and resign both Jack and Landry for a little more than they're currently on if need be, because the next offseason, AB and RJ are gone and that brings the team well below luxury tax then. The future looks real bright, with Curry on a salary that now looks like a real steal, compared to the uncertainty we all had one year ago. Klay and Barnes will be on rookie contracts for a few more years and Rush has to proff himself worthy of anymore good money. For that matter, so does Bogut, who also has just one year left on his contract and will have to show that he deserves resigning at anywhere near that amount money. If he is injured often next season and still wants to stay, he'll have to take less years and less than 9 million for sure.

Definate options ahead for the team and all look rather good for getting even better than we already are.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 2:48 pm
migya wrote:On Barnes - The guy has all the tools to be an allstar caliber player at least. When he was in high school, he was touted as the greatest player at that level and already had a great outside shot. In college, he was a marksman and his outside shot was said to be beyond nba ready. He has shown this season that he is capable of not being the man, not being the fitst option and that is a nice humble trait. Right now he is the sixth or seventh option offensively when the team is fully healthy, as I think Bogut is even ahead of him offensively as option. Barnes has handled the ball better than expected and has rebounded quite well in his time. He will develop and improve everything and become likely fourth or third option next season. I'm so happy that we have him, especially when very easily we could have missed out on him. He filled the biggest position of need.

The team has got to resign both Jack and Landry, but both will likely be offered a bit more money than what they're on now. It'd be great to be able to trade both AB and RJ for no salary in return, but that's very unlikely. That'd give the FO some 21 million extra to play with and that in itself would certainly allow for the signing of a difference maker, not that the team really needs one with what they've already got. Jack will be very hard to replace I think, with what he gives and allowing Curry to play off the ball quite a bit. There are other bigs that could replace Landry, heck, imagine being able to at least get rid of one of AB or RJ and not get any salary in return, that'd allow for the signing of JSmith of Atlanta for what he's on now, who'd make a great 6th man.

Even if the team can't get rid of one or both aB and RJ, they should pay luxury tax and resign both Jack and Landry for a little more than they're currently on if need be, because the next offseason, AB and RJ are gone and that brings the team well below luxury tax then. The future looks real bright, with Curry on a salary that now looks like a real steal, compared to the uncertainty we all had one year ago. Klay and Barnes will be on rookie contracts for a few more years and Rush has to proff himself worthy of anymore good money. For that matter, so does Bogut, who also has just one year left on his contract and will have to show that he deserves resigning at anywhere near that amount money. If he is injured often next season and still wants to stay, he'll have to take less years and less than 9 million for sure.

Definate options ahead for the team and all look rather good for getting even better than we already are.

The tough thing is; with the cumulative penalties being employed on the luxury tax now, it really doesn't behoove us to resign Landry and Jack, putting us over the cap, since we're not looking at a title run next year anyway. The only time a consecutive trip over the cap is a good idea is when you're trying to dynasty a few titles together. We're not there yet, so either Landry or (more likely) Jack will have to go.

As good as he's been this year, that doesn't break my heart. I have every bit of confidence that we are capable of finding a backup point guard next year; it's the easiest position to fill well. Look at our track record: Jarrett Jack, Nate Robinson, CJ Watson, Will Bynum... literally, we end up with backup point guards EVERY year that our fan base falls in love with and everyone cries when they leave, but it's just business. Next year, there are a TON of free agent points we can sign on the cheap:

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/85896 ... -2013-2014

Jose Calderon, Gary Neal, Tony Douglas, Patty Mills, Earl Watson, Randy Foye, Shaun Livingston, Devin Harris, Jeff Teague, CJ Watson, Nate Robinson, Booby Gibson, Beno Udrih, DJ Augustine... not to mention, Chris Paul is the headline free agent. We'll probably lose Jack, because he's one of the top 5 free agent point guards, but the other options for a backup 1 are pretty plentiful. I personally LOVE Tony Douglas and I'd like to wrestle him from the Kings.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 5:16 pm
We can't re-sign both even if we wanted to. Once you're over the cap, you're only allowed to used "exceptions" to sign additional players. We'll have the full MLE and bi-annual, but neither of them will take the bi-annual as they're making more than that right now.

Migs, in the most friendliest way, you drive me crazy when you bring stuff up like, "we should try to trade RJ and Andris without taking salaries back". Could you name one.... just ONE team who would absorb their contract FOR FREE!?!?!??!! C'mon, man. I know you said it's unlikely, but just mentioning is absurd to me. I really don't know how you win most knowledgable. Lol.
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 24, 2013 10:58 pm
32 wrote:
migya wrote:On Barnes - The guy has all the tools to be an allstar caliber player at least. When he was in high school, he was touted as the greatest player at that level and already had a great outside shot. In college, he was a marksman and his outside shot was said to be beyond nba ready. He has shown this season that he is capable of not being the man, not being the fitst option and that is a nice humble trait. Right now he is the sixth or seventh option offensively when the team is fully healthy, as I think Bogut is even ahead of him offensively as option. Barnes has handled the ball better than expected and has rebounded quite well in his time. He will develop and improve everything and become likely fourth or third option next season. I'm so happy that we have him, especially when very easily we could have missed out on him. He filled the biggest position of need.

The team has got to resign both Jack and Landry, but both will likely be offered a bit more money than what they're on now. It'd be great to be able to trade both AB and RJ for no salary in return, but that's very unlikely. That'd give the FO some 21 million extra to play with and that in itself would certainly allow for the signing of a difference maker, not that the team really needs one with what they've already got. Jack will be very hard to replace I think, with what he gives and allowing Curry to play off the ball quite a bit. There are other bigs that could replace Landry, heck, imagine being able to at least get rid of one of AB or RJ and not get any salary in return, that'd allow for the signing of JSmith of Atlanta for what he's on now, who'd make a great 6th man.

Even if the team can't get rid of one or both aB and RJ, they should pay luxury tax and resign both Jack and Landry for a little more than they're currently on if need be, because the next offseason, AB and RJ are gone and that brings the team well below luxury tax then. The future looks real bright, with Curry on a salary that now looks like a real steal, compared to the uncertainty we all had one year ago. Klay and Barnes will be on rookie contracts for a few more years and Rush has to proff himself worthy of anymore good money. For that matter, so does Bogut, who also has just one year left on his contract and will have to show that he deserves resigning at anywhere near that amount money. If he is injured often next season and still wants to stay, he'll have to take less years and less than 9 million for sure.

Definate options ahead for the team and all look rather good for getting even better than we already are.

The tough thing is; with the cumulative penalties being employed on the luxury tax now, it really doesn't behoove us to resign Landry and Jack, putting us over the cap, since we're not looking at a title run next year anyway. The only time a consecutive trip over the cap is a good idea is when you're trying to dynasty a few titles together. We're not there yet, so either Landry or (more likely) Jack will have to go.

As good as he's been this year, that doesn't break my heart. I have every bit of confidence that we are capable of finding a backup point guard next year; it's the easiest position to fill well. Look at our track record: Jarrett Jack, Nate Robinson, CJ Watson, Will Bynum... literally, we end up with backup point guards EVERY year that our fan base falls in love with and everyone cries when they leave, but it's just business. Next year, there are a TON of free agent points we can sign on the cheap:

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/85896 ... -2013-2014

Jose Calderon, Gary Neal, Tony Douglas, Patty Mills, Earl Watson, Randy Foye, Shaun Livingston, Devin Harris, Jeff Teague, CJ Watson, Nate Robinson, Booby Gibson, Beno Udrih, DJ Augustine... not to mention, Chris Paul is the headline free agent. We'll probably lose Jack, because he's one of the top 5 free agent point guards, but the other options for a backup 1 are pretty plentiful. I personally LOVE Tony Douglas and I'd like to wrestle him from the Kings.



I can't recall a backup guard as effective for us as Jack, in all the years I've been watching the GSW. I mean that, I can only think of Monta, when JRich was here, and he wasn't what Jack was this season as the backup. The fact the team made the playoffs and Jack was as good and important as he was, means he has got to be kept, unless a real good PG can be attained to replace him and I don't see any available WHO WON'T likely be resigned by their current teams, that can be that.

If I'm not wrong, you get hammered cumulatively if you go over the salarycap years after one another, but if the team only does so for next season and then after AB and RJ come off the books the season after, that's back under the salarycap. Only when Klay and Barnes are up for resigning will salary be an issue again and by that time, Lee will be at the end of his and close to his mid thirties, so likely to be resigned for a couple of million less a season.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 12:21 am
The Warriors have to sign Jack at all cost. Without Jack, there is no guarantee that the Warriors will make the playoffs next year, he was that important for us. What are the consequences anyways of going over the luxury tax? These owners have so much money.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 1:46 am
8th ave wrote:We can't re-sign both even if we wanted to. Once you're over the cap, you're only allowed to used "exceptions" to sign additional players. We'll have the full MLE and bi-annual, but neither of them will take the bi-annual as they're making more than that right now.

Migs, in the most friendliest way, you drive me crazy when you bring stuff up like, "we should try to trade RJ and Andris without taking salaries back". Could you name one.... just ONE team who would absorb their contract FOR FREE!?!?!??!! C'mon, man. I know you said it's unlikely, but just mentioning is absurd to me. I really don't know how you win most knowledgable. Lol.



Nice one.

There are a few of teams that are well under the lux cap going into next season and some of them have players who are undesirable and yet have only one or two years left on their contracts.

Sacramento - Even if they resign Tyreke for ten to twelve million a year, they are still under the salarycap and very much below the lux cap. We could take back either Outlaw (3 million a year, two years left) or Hayes (5.85 million average a year, two years left). They can have both or either AB and RJ. They become major players in free agency next offseason.

Milwaukee - Drew Gooden (6.68 million a year, two years left) is garbage now, more then AB even, and the Bucks will be even further under the salarycap with the likes of Dalembert and Dunleavy coming off their books. They'll be major players if they want in this offseason's FA and could be so next offseason as well, even if they got one or both AB and RJ.

Philadelphia - They'll resign Bynum to about the same money as he's on now, close to 17 million a year, and they'll be some eight million under the salary cap, with only eight players under contract, so they'll spend all that filling the rest of the spots. AB and RJ for JRich (6.4 million average a year, two years) will make them major players in the following offseason's FA. JRich coming home for his last couple of years of good pay would be fitting.

Portland - They'll resign Hickson for a fair amount more than the 4 million he's on now, like 10 million a year, but they can afford to trade Freeland (3.05 million average a year, two years) for AB and be under the salary cap next offseason and in a position to add to their young core.
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 25, 2013 7:34 am
What about a trade of Barnes and Green to the Spurs for Leonard and Blair? As much as I love Barnes, I think we could improve with Leonard's defence and Blair would be a handy backup c/pf.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 26, 2013 12:05 am
I think Barnes will be better than anyone the Spurs have right now besides Parker, Ginobili and Duncan and even then, who knows.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 10:24 pm
Jarrett Jack on resigning with the Warriors for next season:

“I think it’s just a perfect marriage. My teammates, the camaraderie we have, I like my role. I like what I’m able to bring to this team. Could I go somewhere and it would be bigger, but we might not be playing for as much? I try to make it a perfect marriage. The economics, that’s going to take precedent at times, but you also want to be happy. That’s the most fulfilling thing I have playing on this team.”

Hopefully the Warriors front office can get this done.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 11:00 pm
Most of the time money talks the most and the FO likely won't offer more than 7 million, though Jack has performed to perhaps a little more. As I've said before, I'd resign him for 8 million a year for four years, no more time as he is 29 years old. You pay luxury tax for next season, then you go way below again because of AB and RJ coming off the books. Then the FO can aim even higher and still keep Klay and Barnes.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 27, 2013 11:07 pm
"The economics, that’s going to take precedent at times, but you also want to be happy. That’s the most fulfilling thing I have playing on this team"

It sounds like he's prepared to take less money than he would get from other teams just to stay with this Warriors team.
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PostPosted: Sun Apr 28, 2013 10:51 am
I hesitate towards resigning Jack for a couple reasons.

I've already stated that backup point guards are plentiful and finding a good one isn't hard. I'm not saying it'll be easy to find one whose done what Jack has done this year, but if the choice becomes a serviceable 10-and-5 guy off the bench for $1.5 million, or Jack for $7 or $8 million per... I don't think Jack is 8x the backup we could potentially find for a fraction of the cost. When Jack speaks about "economics" with the implication of a hometown discount, that doesn't mean he's going to throw away his big payday to give the Warriors a deal. If he gets offered $8 million per, he'll want AT LEAST $6 million per from us; probably in the ballpark of $7 or $7.5 million.

A point guard of Jack's ability is a commodity. Teams will be aggressive in their pursuit of him. He's got starter-talent but he won't break the bank. That's something smart GMs target. Assuming he needs $8 million to stay here... How many of us want to commit $8 million of the annual payroll to a backup, considering 39% of the total payroll is locked into Lee and Curry? That would leave us (taking Jack into account) with 51% of the total payroll to resign Barnes, Bogut, and Thompson (which averages out to $11.9 million per among the 3 of them). Okay, fine. Bogut will probably cost a little more, Barnes a little less... Whatever. But it leaves NOTHING for the remaining parts of the roster. Don't we wanna keep Ezeli and Green, too? Don't we need a backup wing, like Rush? Don't we need a backup 4, like Landry?? Committing big money to a position whose already got a big money starter means scrimping in other areas. The lightening in a bottle depth that we acquired this year won't happen again for 5-6 years if we give Jack a large multiyear deal.

Besides, Jack - by all indications - is having a career year in anticipation of free agency. How likely is it that he'll average higher than his career norms in 5 major categories again? To me, his salary is perfect where it's at. If you can get him for $5 to $6 million per, fine. If not, let him walk. We have a lot of other resigns coming down the pipe that take precedent over Jack. I don't wanna lose Bogut or Thompson because Jarrett Jack caught fire for one season.

Prioritize, think long-term. Don't pay Jack more than what he's worth; let another sucker do that (like the Clipps with DeAndre Jordan).
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