Grizzlies exploring Trade Options with Gay

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 2:17 pm
Points allowed per 100 possessions.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:35 pm
http://www.ibabuzz.com/warriors/2013/01 ... ing-there/


According to a source, the Warriors engaged in preliminary talks with Memphis about star small forward Rudy Gay. But the talks didn’t produced much as Memphis is not interested in taking the Warriors’ less-desirable contracts (such as Richard Jefferson) and the Grizzlies want what the Warriors don’t have.

Yahoo! Sports reported Tuesday morning that Memphis and Phoenix are engaged in trade talks. The story, citing sources, said the Grizzlies are shopping Gay. They did stop at the Warriors door.

Gay would be a coup for the Warriors as he would upgrade the small forward position and give the Warriors a difference-maker. But he also comes with a huge price tag: $16.4 million this season, $37.1 million over the next two seasons.

Warriors executive board member Jerry West, formerly the Grizzlies’ general manager, is high on Gay. And with Andrew Bogut’s return uncertain, the Warriors could use another dominant player.

But Memphis is looking to cut salary, which means they want young players, expiring contacts or draft picks. The Warriors have several young players, but no expiring contracts and no picks to trade.

Plus, the luxury tax-conscious Warriors aren’t interested in taking on a big contract without sending out one of their own. Certainly, any deal involving such big numbers would have to include Richard Jefferson (due $11 million next season) or Andris Biedrins (due $9 million next season (though without Bogut, Golden State may not be interested in giving up Biedrins right now).

There is “nothing there” now. But if Gay is still a Grizzly come the trade deadline, my that could could change.
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 4:43 pm
[-o< PLEASE, God, make it happen!!!
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:01 pm
Probably won't happen, they want a shooter to open up things for Z. Bo and Gasol.
Last edited by Blackfoot on Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:04 pm
No surprise the warriors are interested, but the major hickup appears to be what the Griz are willing to take. We don't have draft picks, plus RJeff doesnt expire till next year, I am warming up to the idea, just hope it doesn't cripple us as far as the cap goes. When I say cripple us, I mean having the money to keep a strong bench, and not be in the predicument that the griz have put themselves in. Its just that price tag for Rudy Gay its so damn much. Either way I wont be mad. I am kinda torn, I am not leaning heavy on either.


This is the kind of move that shows at least the warriors know what they are doing, sometimes, you do have to make a sacrifice, ala Barnes. They way it is shows that Barnes is already as asset so, it was great drafting by the warriors.

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 08, 2013 5:08 pm
I am not Pro or anti-Gay, I am in the middle. :letitallout:
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:52 am
Man that Harrison Barnes deal is horrible 32. :roll:

I know you gotta give the Grizz a piece. But I'd much rather give them KLAY FOR GAY!

Contracts obviously don't work but KLAY, JEFFERSON/BEANS for Rudy Gay.

Move Barnes to the SG position and we are sorted. I reckon Barnes got a sweeter midrange game and could lock down the SG DEFENSE hands down.

Problem is I have no idea what the Grizzle roster looks like and whether or not they could use a SG.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:03 am
Reason I advocate keeping Barnes over Klay is because Barnes was a projected 3rd off the 1st round board pick who somehow fell to us at the 8th spot.

Klay Thompson was the 8th best player in last years draft. There was no falling for Klay Thompson he was taken where he was because he was the 8th best player in the draft.

Barnes is a top 3 athleteism guy with the skills. Both are Jerry West handpicked guys but I just feel like Barnes has more superstar appeal at this stage.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:07 am
I feel you, PAWNO, but I think the league agrees: at this stage, Barnes is worth more than Thompson. And since Memphis, in theory, would be eating a bowling of sh*t (Jefferson's contract), I can't see them doing this without getting our best prospect. Which is fine with me, because acquiring Gay puts us in "win now" mode.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 9:42 am
Warriors are 22-10 with fantastic chemistry...

in case anyone forgot

If Gay is so good, why 1) Are the Grizz so ready to get rid of him 2) So convinced losing him won't cause them to miss a beat in the win category.

why do GSW fans always need 'greener pastures.' This is a playoff team. dude I just wanna make the playoffs for once lol. How many all-defense teams has Gay made? he's getting paid like a superstar and he's not a superstar.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 10:18 am
32, i just thought of one flaw in your suggested trade. Grizz are looking at getting under the tax, and that will not happen with your proposed trade.
In order for that to happen you would have to swap B. Rush for Jarret Jack in you proposed trade, as he is the only one who is garuanteed to come off the books next year.

Warriors get: Gay (16mil)
Grizzles get: Jefferson (11mil), Jack (5.5mil), Barnes (2.8 ), + future 1st rounder.

Thats only way they get under the tax for next year.
Maybe in that scenario they would send us back one of their young prospects (Tony Worten, Pondexter or Josh Shelby).

That gets us under the tax this year, then would have to see if you could trade get under the tax next year by trading beans or just take the tax hit for one year.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:10 pm
This team is off to one of the best starts in the last 15 years, so why would they even consider a trade? Showing interest in a player is one thing, but it all depends on what they'd have to give up for them. They're not going to take AB and Jefferson for Gay. If they did, then I'd be fine with it. But if it costs them a player like Thompson or Barnes, then I'd pass.


32 wrote:
mik0 wrote:We're 22-11. Why would we trade for an overpaid and over hyped SF like Gay. There's a reason why we drafted Harrison Barnes.

Plus, team chemistry. The chemistry our team has should NOT BE TOUCHED.

Because we don't have a wing defender that can hold a candle to him?

Because our weakest position (when fully healthy) is SF?

Because it gives us another gun to open up the rest of the offense?

Because we're a defensive team now and Gay embodies our style of play?

Because it weakens a Western rival who'll go deep in the playoffs with him?

Because he gets you 6 rebounds a game with a legit front court and a slow pace?

Because he's an all-star caliber player?

Because he's still young and has plenty of mileage left?

Because it would only cost a bad contract, an injured player, a draft pick, and a questionable prospect who - with all due respect - slipped from the #2 projected pick down to #7?

There's a plethora of reasons.


A few of those reason carry no weight at all. The fact is that Rudy's 5.8 RPG is only 1.6 rebounds more than Barnes 4.2, but Gay plays 11 minutes more per game than Barnes. Per 48 minutes, Barnes is at 8 rpg while Rudy is at 7.6. Another is Gay's improve defense and that doesn't mean he's able to play defense, not because of his inability to do so, but its more of a lack of motivation. And where will his shots come from? By adding a guy like Gay, who is notorious for being a shoot first player, you're taking away from the players that have gotten this team to where they are. That means Curry, Thompson and Lee aren't going to have the same opportunities. We saw what Lee was like with Monta Ellis. He went from a 20 and 11 guy to a 16 and 9 guy. Without Ellis, he's back to 20 and 11 with this team winning. IMO, Gay is a 6'9 version of Monta Ellis.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 5:46 pm
Oh, come on Bay. You're not gonna make me list out alllllll the reasons Gay is superior to Barnes, are you? This is the Klay-for-Iggy argument all over again! Gay is an established veteran with a track record. Barnes is a green horn with 2 months of NBA experience. Literally, the only argument anyone can make for Barnes is "potential".

Remember how many people cursed the DLee trade because we had to send the Knicks Anthony Randolph? C'mon, check the records. The last time we did a vet-for-youngster deal than erred toward the rookie was when we traded Cliff Robinson to the Nets and used their 2nd rounder on Monta Ellis.

How many of these youngsters actually pan out? If we can acquire an all-star like Gay for a "potential" stud in Barnes, it should be done. Gay is already at the level we want Barnes to evolve into. It'd be one thing of it were Anthony Davis or Kyrie Irving, but it's not. It's Harrison Barnes. He's not a sure-thing yet.
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 09, 2013 11:56 pm
Reasons I'd be against this trade:


1) Chemistry is a fickle thing. 1st rule is you don't mess with it when it's going good. Gay is a ball-stopper a la Monta Ellis. It's not that Barnes is the catalyst for chemistry, it's the symbolic message a trade at this point sends to the rest of the team. Things are going good -- so ship someone out? If Gay were a superstar (or even an all star), that'd be a different story.

2) Gay's contract is ridiculous. $19mil in one of those years, for a player who isn't even an all star? That's ludacris. If Gay is such a difference maker, why have the Grizz been shopping him for years.

3) Harrison Barnes is no slouch. Would've been #1 overall if he came out the previous year. Could've EASILY been the #2 pick in the draft if Bobcats GM wanted to go in that direction. Has already shown flashes of greatness.

I'm weighing the risk / reward. The reward is not worth it. Warriors are 22-12, posed for a playoff run. How many more wins does Gay get you? 3 or 4? With that contract, with the threat to chemistry, not worth the gamble imo.
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PostPosted: Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:29 am
rockyBeli wrote:Reasons I'd be against this trade:


1) Chemistry is a fickle thing. 1st rule is you don't mess with it when it's going good. Gay is a ball-stopper a la Monta Ellis. It's not that Barnes is the catalyst for chemistry, it's the symbolic message a trade at this point sends to the rest of the team. Things are going good -- so ship someone out? If Gay were a superstar (or even an all star), that'd be a different story.

2) Gay's contract is ridiculous. $19mil in one of those years, for a player who isn't even an all star? That's ludacris. If Gay is such a difference maker, why have the Grizz been shopping him for years.

3) Harrison Barnes is no slouch. Would've been #1 overall if he came out the previous year. Could've EASILY been the #2 pick in the draft if Bobcats GM wanted to go in that direction. Has already shown flashes of greatness.

I'm weighing the risk / reward. The reward is not worth it. Warriors are 22-12, posed for a playoff run. How many more wins does Gay get you? 3 or 4? With that contract, with the threat to chemistry, not worth the gamble imo.

Touché sir. I'll respond in kind to your 3 pillars:

1) I think the message you speak of is a positive one: "help is on the way." Players appreciate owners and GMs that have a zest for improving the roster. Had the trade been a house-cleaning one, where the Warriors trade big salaries for picks and expirers, then okay, sure, the chemistry would stuff up and the team would have a hard time recovering. But dishing your rookie wing for a career 18 PPG player is far from throwing in the towel on a good season; if anything, it'll kick up the intensity a notch.

2) The Grizzlies are shopping Gay because they're a small market team who would prefer to only pay 2 large contracts to their tallest starters. Memphis is not a team comfortable being over the cap and with Gay's salary increasing, they'd rather dish him than lose their center or power forward. This does not cancel out the skills: Rudy Gay is a premiere wing. Top 6 small forward - and that's the most stacked position in the league, so that statement carries some weight.

3) Nobody's claiming Barnes is a dud prospect. But he is just that: a prospect. Yes, he has great tools and a seemingly high ceiling, but there's a lot of growth left before he can reach the top 10 at his position. Gay is already there (and will be for at least 5 more years). Just check the P/R/A box scores last night: Gay, 18/5/6. Barnes, 7/3/1. That's pretty drastic for just 10 more minutes (and as I stated in the game thread, Barnes would get more minutes if he produced, but some night's he flat out disappears).

Rudy Gay is expensive, but why do we - as fans - even care? It's not our money and it won't affect us being able to retain our core players. And for a package of Barnes, RJ, and Rush... We would be blatantly picking their pocket. I just don't understand how some people can be so down on Rudy Gay. He's one of the great 2-way players of this league. You can't say that about anyone else on our roster: everyone only has one side of the court their elite at (Curry + Lee = offense. Bogut = defense).
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