Chris Kaman's incredible surprising rise

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 3:17 am
JayPat wrote:considering Camby is outproducing Kaman in every single category except scoring and %'s (in less minutes).


This was for this season only, too. :wink:
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PostPosted: Tue Dec 25, 2007 11:50 pm
The comparison was for current season's stats. Camby is superior in those categories mentioned during this season (as well as the rest of his career).
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 1:04 am
TMC wrote:
migya wrote:That's it as well, Kaman should be ahead of Camby (team wins will make it the other way around ofcourse) and behind Yao and Amare


I wouldn't put him above Camby, tho. Camby's having a tremendous season, and having a big impact on the game for his team. Maybe even bigger than Kaman. Kaman scores more than him, but Camby is better at anything else.

I'm not so sure about Yao, tho. He has the numbers, but he's not looking dominant at all. Of course, he's gonna start in the ASG, but I don't think he's been the best center in the west.

Now that I think of it, it's ironic. So much time saying there are not good centers anymore, and we have a lot of good centers in the west. Amare, Camby, Yao, Kaman, Tyson Chandler, Brad Miller, Beans, Bynum... Not a really big star like Shaq was, but a pretty decent bunch of centers.

If he gets an outside shot, Bynum could be the best of the bunch. Did you see him against Phoenix? He blew up, 28 points on 11-13, and the dude is still only 20!
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 3:32 am
coltraning wrote:If he gets an outside shot, Bynum could be the best of the bunch. Did you see him against Phoenix? He blew up, 28 points on 11-13, and the dude is still only 20!


Yeah, he was impressive. Even more considering his age. He has improved a lot from last year, and seems like he's got the better future of all those mentioned.

The biggest difference, to me, is that he's started to believe in himself. Last year, he seemed a bit lost on the court... that has changed this year. He's, right now, the second best player on the Lakers (surpassing Odom).

Somebody said in Pest's thread about Biedrins that Beans was clearly better than Bynum. That's ridiculous. And you know how much I like Beans.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 7:16 am
JayPat wrote:The comparison was for current season's stats. Camby is superior in those categories mentioned during this season (as well as the rest of his career).



As I mentioned, and you can look at the stats that I provided, Camby barely beats Kaman in those categories and since Kaman has much better percentages and scores much more, he is doing better than Camby this season
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 7:19 am
coltraning wrote:
TMC wrote:
migya wrote:That's it as well, Kaman should be ahead of Camby (team wins will make it the other way around ofcourse) and behind Yao and Amare


I wouldn't put him above Camby, tho. Camby's having a tremendous season, and having a big impact on the game for his team. Maybe even bigger than Kaman. Kaman scores more than him, but Camby is better at anything else.

I'm not so sure about Yao, tho. He has the numbers, but he's not looking dominant at all. Of course, he's gonna start in the ASG, but I don't think he's been the best center in the west.

Now that I think of it, it's ironic. So much time saying there are not good centers anymore, and we have a lot of good centers in the west. Amare, Camby, Yao, Kaman, Tyson Chandler, Brad Miller, Beans, Bynum... Not a really big star like Shaq was, but a pretty decent bunch of centers.

If he gets an outside shot, Bynum could be the best of the bunch. Did you see him against Phoenix? He blew up, 28 points on 11-13, and the dude is still only 20!



Bynum is doing amazing. I admit I thought he was never going to be anything and was just another overhyped draft pick out of high school but he has risen this season and if he hadn't, the Lakers would be much further down the standings
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 8:01 am
migya wrote:
JayPat wrote:The comparison was for current season's stats. Camby is superior in those categories mentioned during this season (as well as the rest of his career).



As I mentioned, and you can look at the stats that I provided, Camby barely beats Kaman in those categories and since Kaman has much better percentages and scores much more, he is doing better than Camby this season


Keep in mind the kind of help both have. Camby is doing his part with Melo, AI and K-Mart (when he plays) in his team, so it's no wonder Kaman is scoring a lot more. I'd be shocked if not. If you put Camby on the Clips, he'd have an average of around 14 ppg (more or less). Still worse than Kaman's, but not by much.

As for the rest of the stats, Camby beats Kaman but a small margin, but that's relative, and you realize so when you check the amount of minutes both play. Camby plays 5 minutes less per game. The difference would be a bigger if not. He would also score a bit more with 5 more minutes, although not much. Maybe 2 or 3 more points in his average.

Oh, and Camby is a much better defender than Kaman. Although that doesn't appear on the stats...
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 11:20 am
TMC wrote:Now that I think of it, it's ironic. So much time saying there are not good centers anymore, and we have a lot of good centers in the west. Amare, Camby, Yao, Kaman, Tyson Chandler, Brad Miller, Beans, Bynum...

Now try comparing them to Patrick Ewing, David Robinson, and Shaquille O'Neal. Hell, an AVERAGE center from the 80's/90's (like Luc Longley, for instance) would be among the top big men in the league today. That's why so many people believe the centers are crap these days. They're getting their numbers... but only because no one is out there to stop them. The only legit, star center in the league right now is Dwight Howard... and look at what he's doing to the competition.

Good centers today are either tall guys with athleticism or tall guys with outside shots. Very few can do both anymore. Amare, Tyson, Kaman, Biedrins, and Bynum have zero midrange. Yao and Brad are cupcakes. That leaves Camby... whose injured half the season anyway.
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 12:23 pm
32 wrote:
TMC wrote:Now that I think of it, it's ironic. So much time saying there are not good centers anymore, and we have a lot of good centers in the west. Amare, Camby, Yao, Kaman, Tyson Chandler, Brad Miller, Beans, Bynum...

Now try comparing them to Patrick Ewing, David Robinson, and Shaquille O'Neal. Hell, an AVERAGE center from the 80's/90's (like Luc Longley, for instance) would be among the top big men in the league today. That's why so many people believe the centers are crap these days. They're getting their numbers... but only because no one is out there to stop them. The only legit, star center in the league right now is Dwight Howard... and look at what he's doing to the competition.

Good centers today are either tall guys with athleticism or tall guys with outside shots. Very few can do both anymore. Amare, Tyson, Kaman, Biedrins, and Bynum have zero midrange. Yao and Brad are cupcakes. That leaves Camby... whose injured half the season anyway.


That's why I said a pretty decent bunch without a real star... :wink:
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 26, 2007 12:40 pm
TMC wrote:
32 wrote:
TMC wrote:Now that I think of it, it's ironic. So much time saying there are not good centers anymore, and we have a lot of good centers in the west. Amare, Camby, Yao, Kaman, Tyson Chandler, Brad Miller, Beans, Bynum...

Now try comparing them to Patrick Ewing, David Robinson, and Shaquille O'Neal. Hell, an AVERAGE center from the 80's/90's (like Luc Longley, for instance) would be among the top big men in the league today. That's why so many people believe the centers are crap these days. They're getting their numbers... but only because no one is out there to stop them. The only legit, star center in the league right now is Dwight Howard... and look at what he's doing to the competition.

Good centers today are either tall guys with athleticism or tall guys with outside shots. Very few can do both anymore. Amare, Tyson, Kaman, Biedrins, and Bynum have zero midrange. Yao and Brad are cupcakes. That leaves Camby... whose injured half the season anyway.


That's why I said a pretty decent bunch without a real star... :wink:

The league has never had a worse crop of big men. Dwight Howard, Emeka Okafor, Greg Oden, and several others give us hope, but right now we've hit an all-time low.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 12:38 am
Looking back to Marcus Camby...

Tonight's line vs. the Bucks: 10 points, 11 rebounds, 10 blocks, 5 assists, 2 steals. Damn. (yeah I know this isn't relevant)
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 12:40 am
Holy crap, ten blocks? How does that happen?
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 12:43 am
I bet he swatted Yi's shots around a little bit. Bogut is a little slow for Camby too. Still, an impressive feat to say the least.
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 3:00 am
sfsfsfgiants wrote:Holy crap, ten blocks? How does that happen?


It usually happens when a certain player blocks ten shots taken by their rivals in the same game. :mrgreen:
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PostPosted: Thu Dec 27, 2007 4:49 am
TMC wrote:Keep in mind the kind of help both have. Camby is doing his part with Melo, AI and K-Mart (when he plays) in his team, so it's no wonder Kaman is scoring a lot more. I'd be shocked if not. If you put Camby on the Clips, he'd have an average of around 14 ppg (more or less). Still worse than Kaman's, but not by much.


Camby is very important to the Nugs and so is worth more than Kaman to me but it really can't be proved as Kaman is about the only bright spot (Maggette another) for the Clips but take him away and the Clips would be worse than Minnesota. I'd rather have Camby anyway but Kaman has outdone him


TMC wrote:As for the rest of the stats, Camby beats Kaman but a small margin, but that's relative, and you realize so when you check the amount of minutes both play. Camby plays 5 minutes less per game. The difference would be a bigger if not. He would also score a bit more with 5 more minutes, although not much. Maybe 2 or 3 more points in his average.


2 or 3 points in just 5 more minutes?! :shock: Think again buddy, that's an amazing amount in just five minutes. He does play five minutes less and that will make him look better but not a whole lot better


TMC wrote:Oh, and Camby is a much better defender than Kaman. Although that doesn't appear on the stats...


I agree but statistically, Kaman is a very good defender himself. My whole point here is just to show how great Kaman has done, an improvement far better than most bigs I've seen in a long time
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