migya wrote:The guy I look to being a real superstar guard is Wade. This guy is just amazing to watch and he has no real outside shot yet. Wade could really be among the most complete guards ever and he is not that tall

Yeah... and soon we'll see what he's able to do with no real help in his team, as Miami's roster is aging fast. Although I like what I've seen of Dorell Wright...

migya wrote:Kobe was always going to be a star and I think Shaq's presence with star guards is overrated, though he is a good partner to have to take away the pressure and some of the attention.

How can it be overrated when it's not even acknowledged? Nobody gives Shaq any credit for the success of Hardaway, Bryant, and Wade... nobody, but the three ballers themselves, that is.

Just to reitterate, I'm not claiming that these guards wouldn't have become above-average players overtime... but the Shaq effect is simply too amazing to ignore.

#32 wrote:Just to reitterate, I'm not claiming that these guards wouldn't have become above-average players overtime... but the Shaq effect is simply too amazing to ignore.

I'm not saying Shaq didn't help them become stars... but it was bound to happen with those three. Having Shaq as a teammate only made them more succesful in terms of titles.

I don't know 32, the list of people with wade or kobe's athleticism that didn't become stars is pretty short. The list of people with kobe's combo work ethic and athleticism is pretty damn exclusive and is all superstars.

tHe_pEsTiLeNcE wrote:I don't know 32, the list of people with wade or kobe's athleticism that didn't become stars is pretty short.

I never took Dwayne Wade to be particularly gifted, athletically.

When I think of a gifted athlete, I think of somebody like LeBron James, whose taller than most forwards, but as quick as the fastest guards in the league... and among the league's highest flyers to boot.

Dwayne Wade is 6'4", which makes him 2 inches short for his chosen position of shooting guard. His body is tightly pulled together, unlike lanky players such as Kobe Bryant or Tracy McGrady. This increases the risks of pulls, tears, or strains. He's also not a particularly strong. Tough, yes, but not strong.

Wade's leaping ability is off the charts, but that's pretty much it, as far as I can tell.

And I also don't know if I agree with the statement. There's a HUGE laundry list of athletic players that come into the league raw, get a huge contract on potential, and never live up to the hype. Guys like Kobe are the exception; not the rule.

TMC wrote:

#32 wrote:Just to reitterate, I'm not claiming that these guards wouldn't have become above-average players overtime... but the Shaq effect is simply too amazing to ignore.

I'm not saying Shaq didn't help them become stars... but it was bound to happen with those three. Having Shaq as a teammate only made them more succesful in terms of titles.

Right on point. These three guys were great before they arrived in the nba and Shaq actually needed them to win a championship (Penny not included). Hardaway was the biggest surprise as he fell quickly and never reached the heights that his talent could have taken him

migya wrote:Hardaway was the biggest surprise as he fell quickly and never reached the heights that his talent could have taken him

On the other side, it's hard to keep playing at that level without knees...

Kemp had some decent years in Cleveland. Not quite as explosive but pretty effective.

Supposedly he's at 250 which seems like his ideal weight. The guy had something of a mid-range shot back in the days so I actually think he could be a very poor man's Amare. Could probably be a decent backup for someone at veteran minimum. Won't do his legacy any good but I could see him get 7-8 pts and 4-5 rebounds in limited minutes.

cladden wrote:Kemp had some decent years in Cleveland. Not quite as explosive but pretty effective.

His first season in Cleveland was fantastic, but he ate himself out of the league after that year.

As for now, he doesn't have much legacy left... I don't think he can tarnish anything.

cladden wrote:Kemp had some decent years in Cleveland. Not quite as explosive but pretty effective.

Supposedly he's at 250 which seems like his ideal weight. The guy had something of a mid-range shot back in the days so I actually think he could be a very poor man's Amare. Could probably be a decent backup for someone at veteran minimum. Won't do his legacy any good but I could see him get 7-8 pts and 4-5 rebounds in limited minutes.

Kemp played a great first year for the Cav's just to stick it to Seattle. He wanted to show them that they paid the wrong guy. After that, I think he lost his motivation and zest for the game. Kemp seems like the kind of guy whose looking more for the paycheck and less for the love of the game.

If a contender gets desperate for a big man that can guard Shaq (aka, New Jersey), than I can see someone picking him up halfway through the season. But I doubt it'll be more than a one-year deal. Hell, I doubt anyone will pick him up. Kemp's been lobbying for an NBA spot the past few years. This is nothing new.