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Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:23 pm
by migya
It is not just steals that shows the efectivenss of a player defensively! Pietrus was one of the only players on the team that guarded guys close and pressure like that makes a big difference!

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:55 pm
by 32
Name ONE defensive stopper guard who can't average 1.0 steals in 31 minutes a game and I'll retract that statement.

Posted: Sat Feb 24, 2007 11:20 pm
by migya
32 wrote:Name ONE defensive stopper guard who can't average 1.0 steals in 31 minutes a game and I'll retract that statement.



No need to go any further than Bruce Bowen! The guy averages less than a steal now and has for his career and he is considered as a top defensive player! Like I said, it is not the numbers but how you play defense and Pietrus hassles the oppositions players more than anyone on the team so far

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 3:10 am
by TMC
migya wrote:It is not just steals that shows the efectivenss of a player defensively! Pietrus was one of the only players on the team that guarded guys close and pressure like that makes a big difference!


I'm with migya on this one. Steals are overrated as a defensive stat. You can be a lock down defender and not average 1 steal per game... while other players can average 3 steals and still give up too many easy baskets due to risking too much to get those steals.

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 5:49 am
by migya
TMC wrote:
migya wrote:It is not just steals that shows the efectivenss of a player defensively! Pietrus was one of the only players on the team that guarded guys close and pressure like that makes a big difference!


I'm with migya on this one. Steals are overrated as a defensive stat. You can be a lock down defender and not average 1 steal per game... while other players can average 3 steals and still give up too many easy baskets due to risking too much to get those steals.



Not that Pietrus is a lockdown defender - He should be by now and is sometimes BUT stats can sometimes not tell the story, other times they can. Bruce Bowen would be very valuable to any championship contender and he means alot to the Spurs

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 10:19 am
by 32
Bruce Bowen's a cheater.

Every player in the league hates his guts; from the crazy, like Ron Artest, to the very low-key, like Ray Allen. Hell, Pest even posted a graphic of Bowen doing a Liu Kang-looking karate kick into Wally Z's face. He hacks people and fouls them. That's his secret. He's not a lock-down defender. Artest is a lockdown defender. Stephen Jackson has the potential to be a lockdown defender. In the day, Gary Payton was a lockdown defender. Mickael Pietrus is not.

Look at what Bowen's done lately. His hype from 2 seasons ago has majorly died down because so many other players give him bad press. Nobody, but the Spurs, have anything good to say about Bruce Bowen.

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 5:20 pm
by migya
Good response :roll:

Pietrus is perhaps the best perimeter defender the team has so that is worth something, he just hasn't improved to the point where he is essential and Barnes right now is more valuable

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 9:33 pm
by 32
migya wrote:Good response :roll:

Pietrus is perhaps the best perimeter defender the team has so that is worth something, he just hasn't improved to the point where he is essential and Barnes right now is more valuable

Wow, your logic is amazing.

Did you see Bruce Bowen lock down Joe Johnson 4 days ago? Yeah, Joe was limited to 30 points on 14/29 shooting. Amazing defense. Kinda like how Pietrus stopped Kobe in his tracks at a mere 26 points today, huh? :roll:

As far as Pietrus being the best perimeter defender on the team, you're insane. Look at the numbers I've posted on who Pietrus has been guarding. Look at his seasonal statistics. If you won't listen to statistical proof or even normal logic, than this conversation isn't going anywhere. If this were a chess match, you'd be in checkmate right now... but in an argument, one can always stall and BS around, so there's no sense continuing this.

Agree to disagree.

Posted: Sun Feb 25, 2007 9:44 pm
by JayPat
32 wrote:
migya wrote:Good response :roll:

Pietrus is perhaps the best perimeter defender the team has so that is worth something, he just hasn't improved to the point where he is essential and Barnes right now is more valuable

Wow, your logic is amazing.

Did you see Bruce Bowen lock down Joe Johnson 4 days ago? Yeah, Joe was limited to 30 points on 14/29 shooting. Amazing defense. Kinda like how Pietrus stopped Kobe in his tracks at a mere 26 points today, huh? :roll:

As far as Pietrus being the best perimeter defender on the team, you're insane. Look at the numbers I've posted on who Pietrus has been guarding. Look at his seasonal statistics. If you won't listen to statistical proof or even normal logic, than this conversation isn't going anywhere. If this were a chess match, you'd be in checkmate right now... but in an argument, one can always stall and BS around, so there's no sense continuing this.

Agree to disagree.


Seriously, and Kobe would have had 45 if Pietrus had guarded him the whole time, as Jackson was also guarding him.

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 12:34 am
by migya
We will agree to disagree but Bowen not being a heck of a defender just shows biased against him, he has been a defender his whole career

Posted: Mon Feb 26, 2007 4:36 pm
by 32
migya wrote:We will agree to disagree but Bowen not being a heck of a defender just shows biased against him, he has been a defender his whole career

Yes, but in Bowen's case it's completely different. He's had at least 5 big name players come out and say that he's a flat-out cheater in the past 2 seasons. Right now, Ron Artest, Ray Allen, Kobe Bryant, and Gilbert Arenas are all coming to mind... but I know I'm forgetting somebody.

The NBA stars (minus Duncan) don't respect him. That tells me he's just hacking people.

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 1:26 am
by coltraning
err...bowen has made nba all-defense team 6 years in a row, so he's either got a ton of people fooled or he is doing a bit more than kicking and hacking...

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 3:30 am
by migya
coltraning wrote:err...bowen has made nba all-defense team 6 years in a row, so he's either got a ton of people fooled or he is doing a bit more than kicking and hacking...



Some people just follow the logic. It is plain to see with this one that Bowen is a good defender and many others think so

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 4:03 am
by TMC
coltraning wrote:err...bowen has made nba all-defense team 6 years in a row, so he's either got a ton of people fooled or he is doing a bit more than kicking and hacking...


What about both? :wink:

Posted: Tue Feb 27, 2007 9:08 am
by 32
coltraning wrote:err...bowen has made nba all-defense team 6 years in a row, so he's either got a ton of people fooled or he is doing a bit more than kicking and hacking...

I'm just goin by what the NBA players say...

Even when GP was hell on earth for other PG's, they still respected him. No NBA star respects Bowen. And many claim it's because he's a cheater.