#32 wrote:

migya wrote:Murphy just isn't that good, plain and simple. He will come back down to Earth shortly

Nobody's saying he's a star. But the kid can rebound. He's proven it.

And, for some reason, sore Warriors fans who doubted him STILL won't give him any love (even when he's no longer THEIR problem). I find that absolutely amazing. I mean, at least TMC jokingly admitted that he was being stubborn. The rest of you aren't making any sense at all.

Murphy is doing well so far with the Pacers but the fact is the man is not all that talented. If he takes to his strengths, which is shooting and getting the loose rebound and molds around Jermaine O'neal, he will be an asset to his new team

migya wrote:Murphy is doing well so far with the Pacers but the fact is the man is not all that talented. If he takes to his strengths, which is shooting and getting the loose rebound and molds around Jermaine O'neal, he will be an asset to his new team

11 'loose' rebounds a night, huh...?

Like I said... no respect.

I can't recall ONE player who ever averaged 10 rebounds a year for 3 years to ever get THIS little of respect from his own team (or a former team).

I'm glad the Pacers fans appreciate Murphy. The guy's an asset... and they know it.

#32 wrote:

coltraning wrote:Murphy is an effective rebounder on a team where he is not expected to bang down low and where the pace is glacial. That describes Indiana in the era of O'Neal and Carlisle. Murphy doesn't have a good enough 3 to be a nowitzki (circa 2003) style PF, and he doesn't have a post up game, so on a team where he is expected to be a traditional PF, he is mediocre. As long as Rick Carlisle is coaching the team, Murphy will have a home.

That doesn't take anything away from what he's doing. He's outrebounding Jeff Foster and Jermaine O'Neal in equal situations. That's not enough for the doubters to admit that the kid's a good rebounder???

I don't get it; everyone here knows that Jermaine is a good rebounder. Everyone here admits, "If there's ONE thing Jeff Foster can do, it's rebound". And, yet, when Murphy out-does the both of them (on THEIR team, so they have equal - if not more - opportunities), people still make up excuses as to why Murph is getting his numbers...?

Just give the man his props, already. What's it gonna hurt? Its not like he's on OUR team anymore; we don't have to deal with his contract, so why's everyone still hating...?

#32 wrote:PS: After all that talk about how much he capitalized by being the only good rebounder on the Warriors, I better not hear anybody claiming that now he's grabbing rebounds because "the other teams focus on Jermaine O'Neal" or something.

migya wrote:That's right and Murphy needed to play next to a very good big and he now has an easier time getting rebounds and getting open jumpers

Murphy can't win with you people. Either he's grabbing cheap boards on a team without any rebounders or he's capitalizing off Jermaine O'Neal?? Please. I'm almost glad he got trade, for his sake. Nobody should have to live up to those expectations.

Doubters? 32, I have no idea what that even means. You need to clarify this for me. Is there any question that Murphy is capable of averaging 10 rebounds a night, as he has for the past 3 years? Is that remotely a question? Does that mean anyone who doesn't think Murphy was a good fit for the Ws, and had become a soft and ineffective offensive player, is a doubter? I guess by that criterion, most everyone who follows the ws would be defined as such? Now we are supposed to have loyalty to a guy who has left for the Pacers? I don't recall one thread titled Murphy isn''t an effective rebounder. I am sure you can dig up some comments where people said he wasn't an effective rebounder, but the vast majority of complaints about him were that he was slow and unwilling to post up or go inside and that he wasn't a good defender. The truth of the matter is, he settled for ineffective 3s, lurked on the perimeter and played mediocre defense.

Here's my direct and relevant question to you. You say you "are almost glad he got traded" for his sake. How about for the ws? Are they better off with him gone and replaced by Harrington? Take the Dung/Jackson part out of the mix. Who would you rather have on the Don Nelson Ws? Harrington or Murphy?

coltraning wrote:Doubters? 32, I have no idea what that even means. You need to clarify this for me. Is there any question that Murphy is capable of averaging 10 rebounds a night, as he has for the past 3 years? Is that remotely a question? Does that mean anyone who doesn't think Murphy was a good fit for the Ws, and had become a soft and ineffective offensive player, is a doubter? I guess by that criterion, most everyone who follows the ws would be defined as such? Now we are supposed to have loyalty to a guy who has left for the Pacers? I don't recall one thread titled Murphy isn''t an effective rebounder. I am sure you can dig up some comments where people said he wasn't an effective rebounder, but the vast majority of complaints about him were that he was slow and unwilling to post up or go inside and that he wasn't a good defender. The truth of the matter is, he settled for ineffective 3s, lurked on the perimeter and played mediocre defense.

You can think whatever you want about Murphy's overall game; his speed, his athletic ability, his jumper, his defense... whatever. That's fine. But when I'm using the term "doubter"... it's purely targeting those posters who claimed that Murphy would sink, as far as rebound numbers, outside of Golden State's system.

Throughout this thread, many people have continued to deny Murph his rebounding props (despite the numbers he's putting up standing next to Foster and Jermaine). That's not right. Troy Murphy's a rebound hound. And anybody who thinks different is a doubter.

As far as Murphy's defense, his softness on the perimeter, the hesitance to mix it up inside on the block (aside from the occasional box-out)... I totally agree. But to claim that the man's a poor (or even fair) rebounder, after putting up 10 boards a night on two completely different teams, is not right. That's why it upsets me.

coltraning wrote:Here's my direct and relevant question to you. You say you "are almost glad he got traded" for his sake. How about for the ws? Are they better off with him gone and replaced by Harrington? Take the Dung/Jackson part out of the mix. Who would you rather have on the Don Nelson Ws? Harrington or Murphy?

Al Harrington, hands down. No if's, and's, or but's.

My only point is that Troy Murphy is a legit rebounder. And all I was trying to achieve by starting this thread was to get those who doubted him (read: not you, since you obviously know he's a 10 RPG player) to show a little love.

I appreciate Murph's time on the Warriors. But would I rather have his rebounding over Al Harrington (who plays EVERY other aspect of the game better)? Hell no.

migya wrote:Murphy is doing well so far with the Pacers but the fact is the man is not all that talented. If he takes to his strengths, which is shooting and getting the loose rebound and molds around Jermaine O'neal, he will be an asset to his new team

This previous statement I made is accurate and explains Troy Murphy exactly.

As far as him being a great rebounder - He was every season for the Warriors except this one! He was averaging 5 rebounds a game and was no longer the main rebounder for the team. Something not right there hey

32 wrote:
As far as Murphy's defense, his softness on the perimeter, the hesitance to mix it up inside on the block (aside from the occasional box-out)... I totally agree. But to claim that the man's a poor (or even fair) rebounder, after putting up 10 boards a night on two completely different teams, is not right. That's why it upsets me.

coltraning wrote:Here's my direct and relevant question to you. You say you "are almost glad he got traded" for his sake. How about for the ws? Are they better off with him gone and replaced by Harrington? Take the Dung/Jackson part out of the mix. Who would you rather have on the Don Nelson Ws? Harrington or Murphy?

Al Harrington, hands down. No if's, and's, or but's.

My only point is that Troy Murphy is a legit rebounder. And all I was trying to achieve by starting this thread was to get those who doubted him (read: not you, since you obviously know he's a 10 RPG player) to show a little love.

I appreciate Murph's time on the Warriors. But would I rather have his rebounding over Al Harrington (who plays EVERY other aspect of the game better)? Hell no.

We agree completely on this one. Harrington is a real upgrade for nellyball. 32. I was hoping for a while that Nelson was going to play Murphy as a high post center and Diogu as the low post PF, but that was clearly not Nelson's style. One of the great mysteries to me is how Murphy turned from a tough if raw inside player into a soft outside player. Maybe something as a simple as all the broken noses. He is going on six now, and I think he would be wise to wear a mask, ala Rip.

coltraning wrote:Doubters? 32, I have no idea what that even means. You need to clarify this for me. Is there any question that Murphy is capable of averaging 10 rebounds a night, as he has for the past 3 years?

Well, I did. I never said he wasn't a good rebounder, but I said the he was an overrated rebounder, and that in any other team would be a 7-8 boards per game player... So far, seems I was wrong.

TMC wrote:

coltraning wrote:Doubters? 32, I have no idea what that even means. You need to clarify this for me. Is there any question that Murphy is capable of averaging 10 rebounds a night, as he has for the past 3 years?

Well, I did. I never said he wasn't a good rebounder, but I said the he was an overrated rebounder, and that in any other team would be a 7-8 boards per game player... So far, seems I was wrong.

Taken like a man. I'm buying you a beer the next time I see you, buddy.

murphy is averaging 7.6 rpg for indy now, after averaging 10.5 for a while. So much for the argument that he's more consistent than harrington

tHe_pEsTiLeNcE wrote:murphy is averaging 7.6 rpg for indy now, after averaging 10.5 for a while. So much for the argument that he's more consistent than harrington

Well said!

Murphy has gotten back to what he was doing when he was here this season pretty much and he is definately no monster rebounder, decent but nothing huge. The Pacers can have his arse and do what they want with it

tHe_pEsTiLeNcE wrote:murphy is averaging 7.6 rpg for indy now, after averaging 10.5 for a while. So much for the argument that he's more consistent than harrington

Let's wait til the end of the season. If he keeps up his current numbers, we can safely suppose his rebounding right after the trade was fluke.

TMC wrote:

tHe_pEsTiLeNcE wrote:murphy is averaging 7.6 rpg for indy now, after averaging 10.5 for a while. So much for the argument that he's more consistent than harrington

Let's wait til the end of the season. If he keeps up his current numbers, we can safely suppose his rebounding right after the trade was fluke.

And that he is still nothing good

TMC wrote:

tHe_pEsTiLeNcE wrote:murphy is averaging 7.6 rpg for indy now, after averaging 10.5 for a while. So much for the argument that he's more consistent than harrington

Let's wait til the end of the season. If he keeps up his current numbers, we can safely suppose his rebounding right after the trade was fluke.

Well, I think that we can safely say he's extremely inconsistent right now, however, here are his points numbers for indy:
10, 7, 17, 8, 7, 9, 0, 3, 22, 14, 8, 8, 19, 7, 12, 2, 10
You might as well roll a 20 sided die, that appears to be the best way to predict murph's points total
And his rebounding is the same deal:
11,8,12,12,10,10,4,4,8,6,1,4,10,5,11,6,5

Completely random and not even that good.

In the end run, Murph is giving them 9.6 and 7.1 while Harrington is giving us 15.9 and 6.3, while shooting better percentages across the board.

Don't preach to me, pest. I'm the one that said he was inconsistent. He probably tried a lot harder right after the trade... That's the only explanation I can think of, because, at this pace, it won't be long before Foster becomes the starter and Murphy comes from the bench.

TMC wrote:Don't preach to me, pest. I'm the one that said he was inconsistent. He probably tried a lot harder right after the trade... That's the only explanation I can think of, because, at this pace, it won't be long before Foster becomes the starter and Murphy comes from the bench.

Foster is definately the better rebounder and and defends better but Murphy's jump shot makes him more valuable right now I think. It must be difficult for Carlisle because neither one is really good enough to be a starter