Most Dominant by sport...

Talk about any other sports here.

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 1:36 pm
This is different than best. For instance, it is clear that the level of play in the NBA is far higher than it was 40 years ago. Go watch any old game and you will see that. However, I believe that the greats would be great in any era, given the right training and conditioning and level of competition. I was going to have a poll for this, but it is hard to design. An example of dominance is that Nash is averaging 20% more assists than anyone else in the game today, so that would be an example.

So for the purposes of this thread, I am defining most dominant as the one individual who was most clearly above his peers of the time.
All-time I would submit that the following athletes dominated their sports the most, based on statistical or winning disparity between them and the next best:

Hoops - Wilt
Baseball - Babe and Koufax/Gibson
Hockey - Gretzky
world football - Pele
Golf - Tiger
Tennis - Laver/Federer
Boxing - Joe Louis/Ali
American football - ? (maybe Jim Brown?)
Track - Jesse Owens/Jim Thorpe
Swimming - Mark Spitz

Your picks for most dominant?
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PostPosted: Sat Dec 30, 2006 2:17 pm
Good thread, colt. But a hard one... Keep in mind that a player may also dominate an era because the players of that era ain't as good as during other periods, which would skew a bit the results of this "poll".

Hoops - MJ. Six rings at a time in which the league was loaded with stars, more than ever.

Baseball - Know nothing about baseball. It's an alien's game to me
.
Hockey - Like baseball but on ice.

world football - Best I've seen was Maradona... Pele is the other option, but I've got my doubts. It would be much clear if he had played in Europe.

Golf - Tiger

Tennis - I don't watch tennis. That sport is as gay as they come. Just look at Federer. :mrgreen:

Boxing - Rocky... Don't follow much boxing.

American football - Jim Brown... probably. Tough one.

Track - Jesse Owens

Swimming - Alexandr Popov.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 12:32 am
I'll only name the sports I know enough about:

Basketball = Jordan for the reasons TMC said

Tennis = Federer seems to be everywhere but Bjorn Borg apparently was the best by a mile as well

Boxing = Ali apparently was great for so long but Tyson just dominated opponents!

UFC = Royce Gracie. This guy started it all and won more in a short period than anyone else. He was 11-0
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 4:20 am
Basketball - Baron. No? Fine then. How about Michael Jordan when he was a Bull.

Baseball - Babe Ruth probably. And you could add Jackie Robinson too just because he broke the color barrier.

Hockey - Don't watch it. Only know it because the Sharks are from San Jose but other than that, I know nothing. But I have heard of that Gretzky fella.

Golf - Yawn... What a boring sport. It's a retirement sport in other words. Tiger of course. But hey, you do get a sh*t load of Jackson's and Benjamin's if you win professionally.

Tennis - Don't watch this boring one either. Though I don't mind watching the women play. Agassi for me though.

Boxing - Ali. If it ain't him, then no one.

NFL - Jim Brown. The greatest RB and player of the game has ever had. Don't mind adding maybe Brett Farve in here.
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 10:54 am
migya wrote:I'll only name the sports I know enough about:

Basketball = Jordan for the reasons TMC said

Tennis = Federer seems to be everywhere but Bjorn Borg apparently was the best by a mile as well

Boxing = Ali apparently was great for so long but Tyson just dominated opponents!

UFC = Royce Gracie. This guy started it all and won more in a short period than anyone else. He was 11-0

hey Migya - what's UFC?
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 11:39 am
coltraning wrote:
migya wrote:I'll only name the sports I know enough about:

Basketball = Jordan for the reasons TMC said

Tennis = Federer seems to be everywhere but Bjorn Borg apparently was the best by a mile as well

Boxing = Ali apparently was great for so long but Tyson just dominated opponents!

UFC = Royce Gracie. This guy started it all and won more in a short period than anyone else. He was 11-0

hey Migya - what's UFC?


Ultimate Fighting Championship. You've never heard of it? :shock:
It is the toughest fighting sport there is because it uses all martial arts and types of fighting, not like boxing that only uses punching. UFC fighters can punch, kick and grapple with submissions. This is a very tough sport
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 11:48 am
migya wrote:Ultimate Fighting Championship. You've never heard of it? :shock:
It is the toughest fighting sport there is because it uses all martial arts and types of fighting, not like boxing that only uses punching. UFC fighters can punch, kick and grapple with submissions. This is a very tough sport


That's yet another gay sport. This is how a real fighter looks like:

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:mrgreen:
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 4:49 pm
TMC wrote:
migya wrote:Ultimate Fighting Championship. You've never heard of it? :shock:
It is the toughest fighting sport there is because it uses all martial arts and types of fighting, not like boxing that only uses punching. UFC fighters can punch, kick and grapple with submissions. This is a very tough sport


That's yet another gay sport. This is how a real fighter looks like:

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:mrgreen:

ask a ninja is hillarious
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PostPosted: Sun Dec 31, 2006 9:51 pm
Yes well............ never seen that
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 1:04 pm
Dominance is such a tough thing to judge, because there's no real system for evaluation. But here are my picks, for what they're worth:

Basketball - SHAQ. He was the modern version of Wilt Chamberlain. Although his stats never reached Wilt's plateau, you gotta keep in mind that he was playing against much better competition. Plus he's got more rings. There's never been any player who demands the amount of defensive respect that Shaq does. Who else has been double and triple-teamed more often than played in single covered? I can't think of anyone.

Baseball - BONDS. Hear me out. Whether or not you think the guy cheated, there was a point in baseball where, no matter what, if you pitched the ball to him (and f'ed up just THIS much), it was out of the park. I know the Babe has reached god status in the US... but you gotta remember, Babe was clocking out those home-runs while team's actually pitched to him. Bonds was walked 177 times and STILL knocked out 73 homers. Nobody else (not even McGwire) was even close.

Hockey - GRETZKY. No one else is even close.

Soccer - Don't care.

Tennis - See above.

Golf - TIGER... but also don't care.

Track - Another 'dont care'...

Swimming - Seriously?... People watch swimming...?

Boxing - MUHAMMAD ALI. The Greatest. Could have boxed in any era (unlike Roy Jones Jr, among others).

Football - JOE MONTANA. If there were only 2 minutes left and my team was down by 5 and my life depended on it, there's no other quarterback in the history of the game who I'd rather have playing. Joe was THAT unstoppable. Quite possibly the most clutch performer in the history of football... and, since QB is so important, that makes him the best, in my book.

UFC - KEN SHAMROCK, in his prime. I know Tito's been knocking him out lately, but the Shamrock from 10 years ago would have snapped Ortiz' kneecap by now.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 2:58 pm
Basketball - Wilt - one has to keep in mind that DOMINATION is how much better you were than everybody else. Wilt had a bigger gap between him and the rest of the league than anybody in NBA history. The guy had a statline of 50-25 and probably double digit blocks. Another year he averaged nearly a triple double with 24-24-8 on 69% shooting from the field. He set nearly every big man record and was so good that he was offered hoops contracts as late as 1988. There is no question that Shaq was a better player, but wilt was definitely more dominant

- honorable mention - oscar robertson - led the league in points and assists one year, but, more importantly, he DOMINATED the assists category like no other. He was averaging 11.4 apg while the #5 guy was averaging less than 6 apg. And that was when the statisticians were stingy with giving out assists.

Baseball - Ruth - Once again, dominance is not the same as best. Ruth played in a patticake league, but he got more home runs than any other team in the league. That is insane. That would be like Wilt getting 80 rebounds per game.

Hockey - GRETZKY. No one else is even close.

Soccer - Don't care. Probably Pele or something

Tennis - I don't know about past tennis so I'll say federer. he's amazing

Golf - TIGER...

Track - Nobody in track dominates. Justin Gatlin for his amazing domination of the record by .01 seconds

Swimming - Who watches swimming?

Boxing - Joe Louis was undefeated for a long time. Ali was better, but louis was unstoppable in his era.

Football - I don't know football.

Dodgeball - Ben Stiller
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 4:37 pm
Basketball - Wilt. Nobody drops 100 on a team and isn't the most dominant player. I think dude averaged 50 points a game one season.

Baseball - Babe. Sorry, Bonds isn't number 1. He hit the most HRs but in an era where everyone was knocking it out at an unparalled rate. Conversely, Babe Ruth hit more HRs than the second and third guys most years. That is stupid. He not only revolutionized the sport but changed how peopl played it. I'd put Josh Gibson up there as well. He allegedly hit 800 career HRs in about 2/3 the amount of games as Babe did.

Hockey - Gretzky. This isn't even close. One might be able to argue for Patrick Roy, but only as the devil's advocate.

Football - Jim Brown. Watching Jim Brown run against defenses was like watching Mike Tyson box kindergartners. Joe Montana was great, but there were other great QBs in the era. Jim Brown was light years ahead of everyone else at the time. He was also the most dominant Lacrosse player ever. Him or Jim Thorpe.

Futbol - Pele. No brainer, much like Gretzky.

Golf - Babe Didrikson Zaharias. Tiger is dominant now, but Nicholas was dominant before as well. But Babe wasn't even close to any of her peers. It helped that she was more manly than Tiger and playing girls back in the 1940s.

Tennis - Federer. He just doesn't lose.

Boxing - Mike Tyson. He barely nudges Ali due to his fighting style. Grown, 300 lbs. boxers were scared to get into the ring with Mike. Ali always won, but he used more guile and strategy than Iron Mike who just abused people. Ali was a better boxer, and a better winner, but boxers were fearful of Tyson's dominance.

Track - Owens and Thorpe. This is hard because Owens was the most dominant runner, but in terms of all of track events Thorpe was the best. Therefore, a tie.

Swimming - Guybrush Threepwood. He could hold his breath for 10 minutes . . . 10 MINUTES! Anyone who has played Monkey Island knows how great a feat that is.

Dodgeball - Patches O'Houlihan. He made everyone else during the era look like a bunch of retards trying to hump a doorknob.
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 9:33 pm
#32 wrote:Dominance is such a tough thing to judge, because there's no real system for evaluation. But here are my picks, for what they're worth:

Basketball - SHAQ. He was the modern version of Wilt Chamberlain. Although his stats never reached Wilt's plateau, you gotta keep in mind that he was playing against much better competition. Plus he's got more rings. There's never been any player who demands the amount of defensive respect that Shaq does. Who else has been double and triple-teamed more often than played in single covered? I can't think of anyone.


Jordan was doubled and triple teamed oten and he was a guard! Harder to throw two or three guys at a guard who has more space to work with than a Center who is close to the basket and has less room to go.

Jordan was the best player every season he played, except his two seasons in Washington. Maybe you can say he wasn't the best in his first two seasons, the first being his rookie season (in which he scored more than any other guard and made the all nba 1st team!) and his second season, where he blew out his knee and missed all but 18 games and then returned to score 63 points on the Celts in the 1st round of the playoffs!


Here is a list of some of his achievements:
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
*Five-time NBA Most Valuable Player (1987-88, 1990-91, 1991-92, 1995-96, 1997-98 )
*Ten-time All-NBA First Team selection (1986-87 to 1992-93, 1995-96 to 1997-98 )
*Selected in 1996 as one of the "50 Greatest Players in NBA History"
*A member of six Chicago Bulls NBA championship teams (1990-91, 1991-92, 1992-93, 1995-96, 1996-97 and 1997-98 )
*Six-time NBA Finals Most Valuable Player
*The 1987-88 NBA Defensive Player of the Year and record nine-time NBA All-Defensive First Team selection (1987-88 to 1992-93, 1995-96 to 1997-98 )
*Entering 2002-03, ranked first in NBA history in scoring average (31.0 ppg), second in steals (2,391), fourth in points (30,652) and in field-goals made (11,513), fifth in free-throws made (7,061), sixth in field-goals attempted (23,010) and eighth in free-throws attempted (8,448 )
*Holds the NBA record for most seasons leading the league in scoring (10)
*Shares the NBA record with Wilt Chamberlain for most consecutive seasons leading the league in scoring (seven, 1986-87 to 1992-93)
*Holds the NBA record for most consecutive games scoring in double-digits (842)
*Holds the NBA record for most seasons leading the league in field-goals made (10) and attempted (10)
*Led the NBA in steals in 1987-88 (3.16 spg), 1989-90 (2.77 spg) and 1992-93 (2.83 spg)
*Holds the NBA single-game records for most free-throws made in one half (20 against the Miami Heat on 12/30/92) and most most free-throws attempted in one half (23 in the same game)
*Shares the NBA single-game records for most free-throws made in one quarter (14 against the Utah Jazz on 11/15/89 and against the Miami Heat on 12/30/92) and most free-throws attempted in one quarter (23 against the Miami Heat on 12/30/92)
*Holds the NBA Finals record for highest single-series scoring average (41.0 ppg in 1993)
*Entering the 2002-03 season, ranks as the all-time NBA Finals leader in three-pointers made (42), second in three-point attempts (114), third in points (1,176), fourth in steals (62), fifth in field-goals made (438 ), sixth in assists (209) and free-throws made (258), seventh in field-goals attempted (911) and eighth in free-throws attempted (320)
*Holds the NBA Playoffs record for highest career scoring average (33.4 ppg)
*Established an NBA Playoffs record with 63 points against the Boston Celtics on 5/20/86
*Entering the 2002-03 season ranks as the all-time NBA Playoffs leader in field-goals attempted (4,497), free-throws made (1,463) and attempted (1,766), second in steals (376) and field-goals made (2,188 ), fifth in assists (1,022), seventh in three-point attempts (446) and ninth in three-pointers made (148 )
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
_________________________


Jordan was the best always, while Wilt and Shaq were not, especially their last few years!


#32 wrote:UFC - KEN SHAMROCK, in his prime. I know Tito's been knocking him out lately, but the Shamrock from 10 years ago would have snapped Ortiz' kneecap by now.



Ken Shamrock was a 2nd tier fighter at best! Royce Gracie spanked his arse in 53 seconds in UFC 1 and he was 30-40 pounds lighter than Ken Shamrock!
Tito Ortiz brutalised Ken Shamrock in their first meeting a few years agao and thrashed him a few months ago in their second meeting by winning in 1min 10secs!

Ken Shamrocks own brother Frank Shamrock who is a few years younger than him, is a far better fighter, having added Jiu Jitsu and kickboxing to his fighting repetoire! He also beat Ortiz in 1999 pretty easily!
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 01, 2007 11:13 pm
migya wrote:
#32 wrote:Dominance is such a tough thing to judge, because there's no real system for evaluation. But here are my picks, for what they're worth:

Basketball - SHAQ. He was the modern version of Wilt Chamberlain. Although his stats never reached Wilt's plateau, you gotta keep in mind that he was playing against much better competition. Plus he's got more rings. There's never been any player who demands the amount of defensive respect that Shaq does. Who else has been double and triple-teamed more often than played in single covered? I can't think of anyone.


Jordan was doubled and triple teamed oten and he was a guard! Harder to throw two or three guys at a guard who has more space to work with than a Center who is close to the basket and has less room to go.

Jordan was the best player every season he played, except his two seasons in Washington. Maybe you can say he wasn't the best in his first two seasons, the first being his rookie season (in which he scored more than any other guard and made the all nba 1st team!) and his second season, where he blew out his knee and missed all but 18 games and then returned to score 63 points on the Celts in the 1st round of the playoffs!


Here is a list of some of his achievements:
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
*Five-time NBA Most Valuable Player (1987-88, 1990-91, 1991-92, 1995-96, 1997-98 )
*Ten-time All-NBA First Team selection (1986-87 to 1992-93, 1995-96 to 1997-98 )
*Selected in 1996 as one of the "50 Greatest Players in NBA History"
*A member of six Chicago Bulls NBA championship teams (1990-91, 1991-92, 1992-93, 1995-96, 1996-97 and 1997-98 )
*Six-time NBA Finals Most Valuable Player
*The 1987-88 NBA Defensive Player of the Year and record nine-time NBA All-Defensive First Team selection (1987-88 to 1992-93, 1995-96 to 1997-98 )
*Entering 2002-03, ranked first in NBA history in scoring average (31.0 ppg), second in steals (2,391), fourth in points (30,652) and in field-goals made (11,513), fifth in free-throws made (7,061), sixth in field-goals attempted (23,010) and eighth in free-throws attempted (8,448 )
*Holds the NBA record for most seasons leading the league in scoring (10)
*Shares the NBA record with Wilt Chamberlain for most consecutive seasons leading the league in scoring (seven, 1986-87 to 1992-93)
*Holds the NBA record for most consecutive games scoring in double-digits (842)
*Holds the NBA record for most seasons leading the league in field-goals made (10) and attempted (10)
*Led the NBA in steals in 1987-88 (3.16 spg), 1989-90 (2.77 spg) and 1992-93 (2.83 spg)
*Holds the NBA single-game records for most free-throws made in one half (20 against the Miami Heat on 12/30/92) and most most free-throws attempted in one half (23 in the same game)
*Shares the NBA single-game records for most free-throws made in one quarter (14 against the Utah Jazz on 11/15/89 and against the Miami Heat on 12/30/92) and most free-throws attempted in one quarter (23 against the Miami Heat on 12/30/92)
*Holds the NBA Finals record for highest single-series scoring average (41.0 ppg in 1993)
*Entering the 2002-03 season, ranks as the all-time NBA Finals leader in three-pointers made (42), second in three-point attempts (114), third in points (1,176), fourth in steals (62), fifth in field-goals made (438 ), sixth in assists (209) and free-throws made (258), seventh in field-goals attempted (911) and eighth in free-throws attempted (320)
*Holds the NBA Playoffs record for highest career scoring average (33.4 ppg)
*Established an NBA Playoffs record with 63 points against the Boston Celtics on 5/20/86
*Entering the 2002-03 season ranks as the all-time NBA Playoffs leader in field-goals attempted (4,497), free-throws made (1,463) and attempted (1,766), second in steals (376) and field-goals made (2,188 ), fifth in assists (1,022), seventh in three-point attempts (446) and ninth in three-pointers made (148 )
__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
_________________________


Yeah, without a doubt Jordan was more dominant than Shaq. A lot of people seem to think that most dominant in basketball means "best center". Shaq was the best in the game from 99-02 (maybe '03 but that's stretching it) best case scenario. Jordan was best in the game from 88-98. Jordan was miles ahead of shaq offensively and defensively (though shaq was a better rebounder). Shaq was obviously a far better rebounder, but there really is no comparison between the two.

I said wilt was the most dominant because at his best he was the most dominant, though he had a shorter tenure in that spot than jordan
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PostPosted: Tue Jan 02, 2007 12:02 am
tHe_pEsTiLeNcE wrote:I said wilt was the most dominant because at his best he was the most dominant, though he had a shorter tenure in that spot than jordan



Wilt was more dominant as far as being further ahead of everyone else in one season, as he averaged over 50 points and a shiit load of rebounds but Jordan was the BEST for a longer period of time so it depends on what the definition of dominant is but I think it is for a combination of being the best for the longest period of time and how far ahead of the rest or majority of the rest a player is.

As far as Wilt blocking shots, I had read a few years ago that it was legal to block a shot when the ball was on its way down and also by putting your hand through the hoop from underneath to block a shot. It was said that Chamberlain did that plenty of times and if so, then he is not as good of a shot blocker as people think as nowadays he wouldn't get away with that
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