#32 wrote:Kidd is amazing, no matter how old he gets. Every season, I wait for it to catch up to him. Every season, it never happens.

I don't know WHAT those critics are talking about when they say he's having trouble with quicker guards. First of all, that's always been the case. Secondly, he's still getting triple-doubles like crazy.

Kidd is one of a kind in the nba in the years he has played. I think only Magic can be a comparison because he too was a PG, though much taller. Kidd gets triple doubles like it is fruit on trees and he doesn't look like slowing down either.

He comes from Oakland as well

migya wrote:Kidd is one of a kind in the nba in the years he has played. I think only Magic can be a comparison because he too was a PG, though much taller. Kidd gets triple doubles like it is fruit on trees and he doesn't look like slowing down either.

He comes from Oakland as well

No. Magic was on a whole different level. There's no comparison between those two. One's a legend, while the other is one of the best PGs of his generation (and I say one of the best because I liked Payton better).

TMC wrote:

migya wrote:Kidd is one of a kind in the nba in the years he has played. I think only Magic can be a comparison because he too was a PG, though much taller. Kidd gets triple doubles like it is fruit on trees and he doesn't look like slowing down either.

He comes from Oakland as well

No. Magic was on a whole different level. There's no comparison between those two. One's a legend, while the other is one of the best PGs of his generation (and I say one of the best because I liked Payton better).

Yea, it's hard to be better than Magic but Kidd does have a case as an alltime great because he makes his trammates around him so much, as he did with KMart and Jefferson

TMC wrote:

migya wrote:Kidd is one of a kind in the nba in the years he has played. I think only Magic can be a comparison because he too was a PG, though much taller. Kidd gets triple doubles like it is fruit on trees and he doesn't look like slowing down either.

He comes from Oakland as well

No. Magic was on a whole different level. There's no comparison between those two. One's a legend, while the other is one of the best PGs of his generation (and I say one of the best because I liked Payton better).

IMO Kidd was a better point guard than payton. Their defense was almost even (Payton was overhyped and kidd is underrated on defense, they were both 8 time all defense at this age), Payton never led the league in assists (the main PG category) whereas kidd was top five a baffling eleven times and first five times.

Kidd is a monster on the boards (which is where I think the magic comparison came from, though a better one would be the big O), Payton was only able to break 6 rpg when his best rebounding team mate was Vin Baker. Payton was a better scorer, but scoring isn't how I judge point guards, though it is considered. I'd take kidds superior all around game and leadership any day.

You know, I'm quite the opposite. I consider Payton underrated overall as a player. I don't think his defense is overrated. Getting in the head of the rivals is also a way to defend.

I love what Kidd brings to the table... but, IMO, he's the third best pg of his time, behind Payton and Stockton (unless I'm forgetting someone... and I'm not counting Nash, as he wasn't playing at his current level during that time).

All I know is that if I'm facing a decisive game, I'd rather go with Payton than Kidd (considering both in their prime).

tHe_pEsTiLeNcE wrote:IMO Kidd was a better point guard than payton. Their defense was almost even (Payton was overhyped and kidd is underrated on defense, they were both 8 time all defense at this age), Payton never led the league in assists (the main PG category) whereas kidd was top five a baffling eleven times and first five times.

Kidd is a monster on the boards (which is where I think the magic comparison came from, though a better one would be the big O), Payton was only able to break 6 rpg when his best rebounding team mate was Vin Baker. Payton was a better scorer, but scoring isn't how I judge point guards, though it is considered. I'd take kidds superior all around game and leadership any day.

I agree that Kidd was more dominant than Payton and he also made his teammates better. Kidd's defense is not really acknowleged but he has always been good

TMC wrote:You know, I'm quite the opposite. I consider Payton underrated overall as a player. I don't think his defense is overrated. Getting in the head of the rivals is also a way to defend.

I love what Kidd brings to the table... but, IMO, he's the third best pg of his time, behind Payton and Stockton (unless I'm forgetting someone... and I'm not counting Nash, as he wasn't playing at his current level during that time).

All I know is that if I'm facing a decisive game, I'd rather go with Payton than Kidd (considering both in their prime).

I think Pauton was one of the best defenders of his era, up there with Jordan and Pippen but overall, he was not as good as Kidd. Kidd passes better and rebounds better. Payton was more of a scorer but he had to be on his sonics teams because they didn't have as many scorers as many people think they did. Kidd has also kept up his level of play while Payton has really fallen for the last three years

migya wrote:I think Pauton was one of the best defenders of his era, up there with Jordan and Pippen but overall, he was not as good as Kidd. Kidd passes better and rebounds better. Payton was more of a scorer but he had to be on his sonics teams because they didn't have as many scorers as many people think they did.

Yeah, Kidd was (is, but we're comparing both in their prime) the better PG, that's clear. I'm just saying that I'd go with Payton first because I like his style better.

I don't think Kidd's and Payton's defense are close, tho. Kidd's a pretty good defender... just not as much as the Glove.

migya wrote:Kidd has also kept up his level of play while Payton has really fallen for the last three years

Payton is 5 years older, migya. Let's see where's Kidd in 5 years (and I'm willing to bet he's retired by then)

TMC wrote:I don't think Kidd's and Payton's defense are close, tho. Kidd's a pretty good defender... just not as much as the Glove.

migya wrote:Kidd has also kept up his level of play while Payton has really fallen for the last three years

Payton is 5 years older, migya. Let's see where's Kidd in 5 years (and I'm willing to bet he's retired by then)

Well, Payton was a more agressive defender but Kidd actually averages 2.0 steals a game for his career compared to Payton's 1.9 steals. Kidd is no slouch defensively.

Payton was quite disgraceful his first three years in the nba and has been the last three or four years as well. Kidd has always been at the top of the nba PGs, so that is 14 seasons. Payton has played 18 seasons (this likely his last) and has been at a very good level (or thereabouts) for 11 or 12 seasons

migya wrote:Well, Payton was a more agressive defender but Kidd actually averages 2.0 steals a game for his career compared to Payton's 1.9 steals. Kidd is no slouch defensively.

Payton was quite disgraceful his first three years in the nba and has been the last three or four years as well. Kidd has always been at the top of the nba PGs, so that is 14 seasons. Payton has played 18 seasons (this likely his last) and has been at a very good level (or thereabouts) for 11 or 12 seasons

You won't make me change my mind. I've got nothing against Kidd. It's just a pick based on the style they played. Just a personal preference.

TMC wrote:

migya wrote:Well, Payton was a more agressive defender but Kidd actually averages 2.0 steals a game for his career compared to Payton's 1.9 steals. Kidd is no slouch defensively.

Payton was quite disgraceful his first three years in the nba and has been the last three or four years as well. Kidd has always been at the top of the nba PGs, so that is 14 seasons. Payton has played 18 seasons (this likely his last) and has been at a very good level (or thereabouts) for 11 or 12 seasons

You won't make me change my mind. I've got nothing against Kidd. It's just a pick based on the style they played. Just a personal preference.

Well that's fine but I'm going with the facts