Best team building strategy to make this team a winner?

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2011 1:24 pm
Dr. Spaceman wrote:We need players and a system that are committed to playing both sides of the ball. Lee although a good player is not the fit for this team without a defensive stud C next to him. Monta can play both if he had a coach that held him accountable for when he's lazy on D (Recent coaches can't because they play him 48 minutes a night). Curry doesn't look like he will ever be a good defender, but with effort could at least become more serviceable.


Sam Dalembert would be a decent option for a really solid defensive post presence. He has played really well in Sac this year, and he's been surprisingly efficient on offense. I think he could be had next year for around MLE, 15 mil over 3 years. Don't know if the Warriors would be willing to take that on though. Even with that I still don't see a legitimate post offense option. I love David Lee, but he doesn't seem like the type of guy you can have post up to get a layup or get the foul line consistently. I think if you sign a defensive minded big man, you need to have a solid offensive post option to compliment him. Just to keep other teams defense honest and open things up for the perimeter scorers.

Tayshaun would be a great to shore up the perimeter D. He guards the elite 2's and 3's as good as anyone in the league. With monta and curry a liability he would invaluable. He's 30 now, just got off a big contract, so I'm not sure what he's looking for. With the Warriors not being a potential championship right now it will be tough to get those solid veterans without way overpaying them.

Looks like next year they will be about 10 mill under the cap, which will give them some wiggle room.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 1:01 am
warchief wrote:If the Warriors want to win, and when I say win, I dont mean 8th seed, 1st round exit. They need to change their identity. This run-n-gun, outscore everyone philosophy hasn't won a title in years, and I don't mean like 5-10-15 years. I'm talking many years. Look at the last teams standing when you watch the Finals every year. I hope Lacob is smart enough to figure out after watching the Celtics as a minority owner built a lockdown defensive title team. And that the Warriors can't win big (titles) if they refuse to play defense and aren't able to consistently run the half court set.


I have to agree with this. this mandate to "run and outscore" and play "entertaining" ball is so Cohan-ish. it's a philosophy based on putting more fans in the seats, not winning. and that's been their philosophy for 15 or so yrs! when was the last time this team ever made their mission about defense.

the front office makeup still needs drastic changes, even if it's just for symbolic / perception reasons. it doesn't mean the roster needs to totally change, but I just don't want those same clowns who worked under Cohan, or who have any association to Cohan, to still have jobs and still be the ones who we have to rely on to make decisions and come up with ways to win going forward.

I think Smart's a good guy and deserves a chance, but you can tell some of his coaching has been crazy-Nellie influenced. is that a good thing? is it a good thing that Lacob didn't fire Rowell's azz because he likes what he did on the "business side?" would Ellison ever let a weasel like Rowell keep his job after he played such a pivotal role in dismantling the We Believe team? new ownership...great...but how can you have a new identity and culture when so many from the old, corrupt regime remain in power.
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 6:37 am
rockyBeli wrote:
warchief wrote:If the Warriors want to win, and when I say win, I dont mean 8th seed, 1st round exit. They need to change their identity. This run-n-gun, outscore everyone philosophy hasn't won a title in years, and I don't mean like 5-10-15 years. I'm talking many years. Look at the last teams standing when you watch the Finals every year. I hope Lacob is smart enough to figure out after watching the Celtics as a minority owner built a lockdown defensive title team. And that the Warriors can't win big (titles) if they refuse to play defense and aren't able to consistently run the half court set.


I have to agree with this. this mandate to "run and outscore" and play "entertaining" ball is so Cohan-ish. it's a philosophy based on putting more fans in the seats, not winning. and that's been their philosophy for 15 or so yrs! when was the last time this team ever made their mission about defense.

the front office makeup still needs drastic changes, even if it's just for symbolic / perception reasons. it doesn't mean the roster needs to totally change, but I just don't want those same clowns who worked under Cohan, or who have any association to Cohan, to still have jobs and still be the ones who we have to rely on to make decisions and come up with ways to win going forward.

I think Smart's a good guy and deserves a chance, but you can tell some of his coaching has been crazy-Nellie influenced. is that a good thing? is it a good thing that Lacob didn't fire Rowell's azz because he likes what he did on the "business side?" would Ellison ever let a weasel like Rowell keep his job after he played such a pivotal role in dismantling the We Believe team? new ownership...great...but how can you have a new identity and culture when so many from the old, corrupt regime remain in power.




The only team and I mean the ONLY team, that I've ever seen win alot and come close to winning a championship with run and gun type of play, was the early to mid 1990s Seattle Supersonics. THAT IS, other than the showdown lakers who we all know won it all many times in 1980s. The Sonics did it (as did the showdown Lakers obviously), BY PLAYING GREAT DEFENSE AS WELL AS GREAT OFFENSE!!!!

You can have a great run and gun type offense, but you have to have it under control and you have to also play very well defensively, not to mention be a good rebounding team as well. The current Warriors just don't have that, on either ends I think.

I truly think that this past offseason was the time to make the needed trades, but since ownership was going to change and so forth, it was just not really possible. The upcoming offseason will have the lockout most likely happen or at least major changes happen that will probably make trades difficult, at least this offseason.

Playing fantasy GM as such - I trade for proper big guys, that is Center and PF, as I don't think Lee is adequate at all. You do that my using Monta and or Curry, as well as coupling AB with one of them in any trade. You just have to make sure you get a very good distributing PG coming here as well and then get the other positions worked out either through more trades I free agency.

This team needs alot of roster changes to say the least
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 10, 2011 10:07 am
Hello to all, been reading here for about 5 years now but have not braved putting my two cents in. I'm an old guy who saw the championship and have suffered since. This is just the topic to make me jump in with an opinion. May be long so just skip it if you want. Team building strategy.

Fisrt I think everyone should agree that whatever the Warriors have done is 180 degrees out, we have gone nowhere consistantly. In todays game it looks like you get 3 high priced players and two of those can not be your two undersized guards that don't compliment each other. Like it or not that's where we will be once Curry gets his money. There is no sense in waiting till this happens and then having to trade. Plan your work, work your plan. I just don't see a plan being worked with this orginization. To build a team I believe two high priced front court players and one back court is the formula. We have shown 0 abililty to draft and develope bigs so we have to sign free agents (overpay as in Lee) or trade. Our pieces to trade are smalls so you can count on giving real good smalls to get good bigs. Over the years we have continually drafted very good guards and sf with not great draft positions so I say lets trade what we have to trade to get what we obviously can't draft and develope. We continually have guys that look great on our crappy team then lock them up with high contracts and then dump them them for cap relief and make the same stupid mistake with the next big thing. You have to have a superstar, which sorry we don't, or you have a gimic team which hasn't worked or you go with a well defined, balanced, traditional line up(as in the Pistons championship team) which seems to be our only shot. So how do we get to a traditional line up. Some will scream we are overpaying but we need to get on with it or stay stuck right where we have been for decades. I will say that my preference would be to keep Curry and Wright and use everyone else but I don't think it' possible. So....
I call Phoenix and try Curry + filler(bell?) for Gortat + a 1st. Settle for a 2nd or just make the deal and get the decent center we need.(no they nor anybody else is going to take Beans in this deal). If this is all you can do I think the change would be huge. Clear up the backcourt tug of war and you now have a sg, sf,pf, c. Closer than we have been in a long time to a normal line up.
But I would try giving Philly a call and offer Monta, Lee and who we draft this year or Ekpe or both for Holiday, Turner and Brand. You can ask for a pick back but doubtful.
Holiday, Turner, Wright, Brand, Gortat is a place to start which I think you can build from. I'm sure there are other ways and I'm not hanging my hat on this one but wishing and waiting is not working. AND GET A REAL COACH.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2011 2:56 am
Get the best coach available. Tell your GM to provide him what he needs. He will know what needs to be done.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 12:20 pm
I would hire Brian Shaw as a coach. I would throw some money at Gerry West and get him as a GM. Then we would have to make some trades. Hold our breath in the lottery and hope we get a good player. and no I am in no way a Laker fan but shaw is a Bay area guy and West is a a proven winner. I would love to aquire a mid first round pick and grab Kemba Walker. I would take a chance on Greg Oden if he could be had at a reasonable Price. I we could trade for Josh smith or Iggy that would be perfect. Well its all dream but since you asked thats my idea. Usually every year there is a late first round pick that gets sold for about three million. Maybe we could grab that. I would also love to keep Thornton and Reggie.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 12, 2011 8:39 pm
I'd rather a coach who has had a fair amount of experience and success, so Adelman could be a good candidate if he leaves Houston (and is willing to come back here after what happened first time he was here).

For someone that has no head coaching experience, I'd like Mario Ellie. That man has guts and credibility, being a tough player when he played and having won multiple championships
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2011 2:38 pm
A modest proposal-

I think the quickest way for the W's to add ten wins to this year's total is by building the bench.

The draft doesn't look likely to produce a dominant player for us. And with what we have to offer, I don't see a trade for Dwight Howard or his likes in our near future :-)

Ergo, let's focus on an achievable improvement by upgrading our bench which is realistically possible with the assets we have to trade and the money we can offer.

Our bench has been consistently outscored this year. Had our bench matched our opponents, we'd be in the playoffs.

(And yes, it would be nice if we learned how to rebound and play a little defense)
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2011 5:52 pm
The best way to do this, is to get better starters and bench what's left.
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 9:59 am
I, too, like Josh Smith and what he can bring to this team. He's still only 25 years old (26 this December) and offers exactly what this team needs..defense and rebounding.

I think the Warriors can entice the Hawks by adding Stephen Curry along with Andris Biedrins. As much as I like Curry, I like Josh Smith even more AND they get rid of Biedrins' contract. With Bibby gone and Horford's desire to play his natural power forward position, this could be a good deal for the Hawks. Curry, Johnson, Williams, Horford and Biedrins could work in the East.

Another guy I love is Evan Turner. The Sixers are on their playoff run and have been reluctant to give Turner big minutes. They'll be looking to get better this Summer. Send Monta Ellis and David Lee for Elton Brand, Evan Turner and Mareese Speights. Speights is getting 11 minutes per game for the Sixers. The get rid of Elton Brand's contract and add a scorer, along with a rebounder, with Ellis and Lee. They also get to keep Iguodala. Holiday, Ellis, Iguodala, Lee and Hawes would be an improved line up.

The Warriors would still have their lottery pick and about $8M to spend on free agents, then they could re-sign their own players like Reggie Williams and Al Thornton..if they choose to. I'd also keep a close eye on Greg Oden. If he could be signed cheap, then he could be worth a gamble.

Another option out there is Raymond Felton. He's been playing great but the Nuggets are still enamored by Ty Lawson and he's been starting. With them needing a power forward, they could be enticed with the Warriors lottery pick in a power forward heavy draft. Along with their own first rounder, they have a chance to not lose a beat. They're still a playoff team and will be looking to build on that. With both teams under the cap, Felton for the draft pick and a $5M trade exception works.

Potential 2011-12 Line up:

PG Raymond Felton - Jeremy Lin
SG Evan Turner - Reggie Williams
SF Josh Smith - Dorell Wright - Al Thornton
PF Elton Brand - Ekpe Udoh - Lou Amundson
C Greg Oden - Mareese Speights
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 6:01 pm
BayAreaHoopz wrote:Potential 2011-12 Line up:

PG Raymond Felton - Jeremy Lin
SG Evan Turner - Reggie Williams
SF Josh Smith - Dorell Wright - Al Thornton
PF Elton Brand - Ekpe Udoh - Lou Amundson
C Greg Oden - Mareese Speights



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PostPosted: Fri Mar 18, 2011 7:29 pm
There are some ideas I like about the previous post, like Josh Smith and possibly Felton. But that much roster overhaul would set us back and give us a more balanced, but still a mediocre roster.

I think getting players and a coach determined to play winning basketball rather than entertaining basketball is what we need. Curry is by far our worst defensive starter that has value. A team like the Hawks would be a perfect trading partner as their lack of a true PG the last few years has been one of their biggest downfalls. And it's no secret that they're going to have to move Smith and get value for him.

Then we would have to find someone willing to take Lee. Or run a frontline of Smith/Lee/Udoh which should bring enough rebounding and defense that all we'd need is a PG who is not a complete liability on defense, takes care of the ball and can pass and we would be in the playoffs.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:31 am
Oden is a great idea. It might be our only opportunity to get a superstar center in a cheap price. If all goes well that is. But i believe that he can be better that anyone we have even with one leg.
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 19, 2011 2:35 pm
do you not understand that defensive players can be MADE with a proper coach? jeez give steph a chance...keith isn't doing anything towards improving his D but taking him outta games every TO
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:13 am
Crocoducks wrote:Sam Dalembert would be a decent option for a really solid defensive post presence. He has played really well in Sac this year, and he's been surprisingly efficient on offense. I think he could be had next year for around MLE, 15 mil over 3 years. Don't know if the Warriors would be willing to take that on though. Even with that I still don't see a legitimate post offense option. I love David Lee, but he doesn't seem like the type of guy you can have post up to get a layup or get the foul line consistently. I think if you sign a defensive minded big man, you need to have a solid offensive post option to compliment him. Just to keep other teams defense honest and open things up for the perimeter scorers.


Warriors need a center who can score some and be an inside defensive presence. I also think the most realistic option would be to try to sign Dalembert in the off season. I'd also try to trade Ellis for Iguodala. Ellis is more talented offensively, but as far as making the overall team better, Iggy would balance the backcourt better and provide more playmaking and defense than Ellis ever could - without giving up too much scoring. then there's Biedrins contract. I think we throw in a draft pick or Udoh to try to sweeten a deal and some team might bite.

curry
iguodala
d wright
d lee
dalembert

very attainable and a more balanced team, just depends if the W's want to go in that direction.
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