Changing of the Guard (SG Stephen Jackson)

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When should Jackson leave?

11%
Trade this year
3
15%
Next Summer with Al
4
26%
Let go in 2yrs (FA)
7
48%
Resign him! I never want him to leave Oakland
13

Total votes: 27

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» Wed Aug 13, 2008 8:00 pm
TheBodyGuard wrote:
bada wrote:Also his dribbling the ball into the heart of the defense for a turnover gets old quick as well.

Don't forget the fit he throws when he thinks it was a foul. That's Jack being Jack.


That's just Stephen Jackson being Stack Jack. :wink:

If you don't know what I mean, you should look up this one article by Ric Bucher. Great piece; it explains a lot of Jackson's history and where he gets the fire and emotion from.

http://www.goldenstwarriors.com/viewtopic.php?t=5747
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» Wed Aug 13, 2008 9:03 pm
xbay wrote:
TheBodyGuard wrote:
bada wrote:Also his dribbling the ball into the heart of the defense for a turnover gets old quick as well.

Don't forget the fit he throws when he thinks it was a foul. That's Jack being Jack.


That's just Stephen Jackson being Stack Jack. :wink:

If you don't know what I mean, you should look up this one article by Ric Bucher. Great piece; it explains a lot of Jackson's history and where he gets the fire and emotion from.

http://www.goldenstwarriors.com/viewtopic.php?t=5747


I love that article, I have it bookmarked. It's the first article I read about Jack and the stuff in it really put his actions into perspective for me. Jack is the best teammate a player could ask for and his contributions are enormous.
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» Thu Aug 14, 2008 10:57 am
xbay wrote:
TheBodyGuard wrote:
bada wrote:Also his dribbling the ball into the heart of the defense for a turnover gets old quick as well.

Don't forget the fit he throws when he thinks it was a foul. That's Jack being Jack.


That's just Stephen Jackson being Stack Jack. :wink:

If you don't know what I mean, you should look up this one article by Ric Bucher. Great piece; it explains a lot of Jackson's history and where he gets the fire and emotion from.

http://www.goldenstwarriors.com/viewtopic.php?t=5747


But he needs to stop that crap. He does it almost every time he takes the ball to the basket or gets stripped and does not get back on defense. It hurts the team and it certainly does nothing to help his reputation among the officials to help get calls. And it is a very poor example for the young players on the team and he is flat out the leader of this team now and needs to adapt to that role.

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Posts: 139
» Thu Aug 14, 2008 11:19 am
I think this season we will be seeing a different Jackson. I think/hope that he is going to mature and become the vet leader that we need him to be. I think since BD left, he'll understand that he is the sole captain on the team and is going to have to take more leadership roles on, hopefully that doesn't translate into him thinking he has to do more offensively.

I'm basically split 50/50 on whether or not he is going to work out for us or not. I'm leaning more toward that he will because of his personal progress over the past years. He has calmed down and began to play smarter. Although I am saying this based more on hope than anything else.
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» Fri Aug 15, 2008 3:25 pm
First Off,
From what I've read and seen about him, Jackson seems like a great guy on and off the court. so don't get it twisted - I don't hate Stephen Jackson the man.

I've already listed my beefs with his game, and even though all the moderators probably wanna kick me off for saying such horrible, stupid things, I still stand by them. they're beefs about his game though, OK?

secondly I apologize for the scatter-brained nature of this long reply. I've been writing this off and on all day. it's more like a collection of thoughts than a single reply

note that I never said Azubuike was a better player than Stephen Jackson. I'd like to see Buike weasel his way into the starting lineup because I think between Monta, Maggette, and Harrington/Wright we have enough offense. I don't want to be the leading team in ppg this coming year. It'd be awesome if the best team's lead the league in ppg, but lets be real here: GSW, Denver, and Phoenix? the "Run and Gun" offenses are amusing, but hollow.

Nelly has gotten the team much closer to a champ than any of the other crappy coaches we've had the last 15yrs and its been great fun to watch, but I think there is a glass ceiling to his game plan.

In an effort to score less, play more like a team, maybe run a little more clock, make the other team get tired on defense, and get an offensive rebound every once and a while - I see a kid that's a little more scared to score, and a little more enthusiastic about rebounding and defending being a better fit.

IF
Jax can settle down into a role player/vet he would be much more useful than Azu. I think he has the God given talent, the experience and the tenacity to be an All-League defensive player, but I'm doubtful if will ever see it (esp with Don at the head coaching position). I just picture Jackson trying to do WAY too much next year with Baron being gone and the lack of Vets: Committing even more turn-overs, being SO emotional and raw it actually hurts the team, playing so hard he gets injured, etc. it's a nightmare I don't want to come true (knock on wood). It could be I'm worrying about nothin, since are starting five don't have to lead the league in minutes played anymore - we may see a dramtic change in the style of play... (Argh! I want the season to start already!). however I believe it's more likely the style will stay the same with jax, Al, and Nelson still on the roster.

Like if you watched Boston in the Finals; I can see him becoming a Sam Cassel, which is good in some cases but overall bad. ill advised one on ones, trying to prove he's still got game (and yes, I know Sam's got way more years on Jax), throwing up some crazy shots that may go in, but overall, it throws the rest of the team out of rhythm.
----
I want respect from the rest of the league. right now, it seems like were just an entertainment team. It's just like Houston's big undefeated streak last year. everyone knew it was just a fluke, and everyone knew they still weren't going to go anywhere in the playoffs. if the league doesn't give Houston - a team that's made it into the playoffs the last few years - any respect, why would anyone fear us?

what would make me happiest as a Warrior fan would be to see them win another championship. not keep their vets forever, not lead the league in ppg, or attempted 3 pointers - a championship. and yeah if we have to copy Boston's style or SA's style so be it.

go watch Ruker Park if you want to watch entertaining street ball with games that are 150 to 140 or whatever. I want to watch my team play basketball (in the post season).

in my opinion - best way to go about getting those two things (respect and a championship) is: 1) let Jackson and Harrington slip away now while their stock is relatively high. 2) suck now but develop our youth 3.) Wait for a superstar offering that fits with the young potential 4.) go for it all in a few years.

no matter how much I bitch and moan, and no matter what style of play they end up with, I'll still watch them... I mean C'mon they're the Warriors!
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» Fri Aug 15, 2008 3:34 pm
LOL, no. We never said we were going to kick you off. We never even thought about it. So don't worry, you didn't break any rules. So no need to apologize.
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» Mon Aug 18, 2008 1:35 am
I'll admit that this is an extreme idea, but it's not completely hopeless. I'm gonna stop bashing SJ and AH until I see what they do this year... I'm assuming the worst with both players (Jax shooting a crazy low FG% and Al continuing to be streaky and not very tough), and that ain't fair to them. They both played a crap-ton of minutes last year. if it does happen this season, this thread will rise from the dead with an "I told you so" post.

I will also do the "I told ya so" dance in celebration of my awesomeness

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GNGc9zmpK5M[/youtube]

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» Mon Aug 18, 2008 8:57 am
i once again would like to reply with "Nelson has brought this team closer to the playoffs than any coachin the last 15 years." Coach Nelson has had the best TEAM that he Warriors have had in the last 15 years. I believe Eric Mussleman is actually a better coach than Coach Nelson. Coach Nelosn is a 50% coach that has never made the chamionship round in 30 years. A lot of us get caught up in calling him Nelly, like we know the guy. We don't know him. He is no different than any other coach. But, by calling him Nelly it makes it seems like he is one of us.

First of all, he don't give a crap about any of the fans. He is not fan friendly. He is rude and obnoxious to the media. He is very surly.

Second: He is a gold digger, every year he holds the Warriors management hostage about whether he is coming back or not. Waiting to the last minute so that the Warriors have to pay him or have no coach.

Third: Most players hate him. He has a history of fights with several players. You can believe one of the reasons Baron left was because of Coach Nelson.

Although I am a Warrior fan. I can't get all gushy over a guy who has such a LOOOOONG mediocre track record. WE WILL NEVER WIN A CHMPIONSHIP UNDER DON NELSON. No one has, and no one will.

Whew: Got that off my chest again for the 100th time LOL.

Everyone have a good day.
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» Mon Aug 18, 2008 3:36 pm
On my homeboy Nelly (he's my dawg):

He had a better starting 5 than the other coaches, but he did a very good job at 2 things:

1. forcing teams to play small ball with us is hard. he was able to do it.
2. managing a team with basically a 7 player rotation is hard. he was able to do it.

yeah he's a little bit of a prick when it comes to the fans, but how many coaches are really that fan-friendly? their job is to lead the team and nothing more. I'd rather have a focused prick, then a charismatic but losing coach.

I agree he seems money hungry though.
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» Mon Aug 18, 2008 4:12 pm
warrior 4 life85 wrote:1. forcing teams to play small ball with us is hard. he was able to do it.


What benefit is it to play small if we can't win? I dont see a point in it. It obviously doesn't win games.

warrior 4 life85 wrote:2. managing a team with basically a 7 player rotation is hard. he was able to do it.


What told you he was able to do it? Oh, yeah, the fact that every one of the seven players that we played got burned out for the last month. Also, the fact that we were on the outside looking in on the playoffs.... again... is another indication that he did it. A good team uses 10 guys. Look at every champion as of late. They had depth and they used it. We have the depth, too. We just dont use it.
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» Mon Aug 18, 2008 4:25 pm
sfsfsfgiants wrote:
warrior 4 life85 wrote:1. forcing teams to play small ball with us is hard. he was able to do it.


What benefit is it to play small if we can't win? I dont see a point in it. It obviously doesn't win games.


We won 48 games last year because of it. Sure, all 48 games weren't all small ball, but the majority of them were with players undersized compared to their opponent.

sfsfsfgiants wrote:
warrior 4 life85 wrote:2. managing a team with basically a 7 player rotation is hard. he was able to do it.


What told you he was able to do it? Oh, yeah, the fact that every one of the seven players that we played got burned out for the last month. Also, the fact that we were on the outside looking in on the playoffs.... again... is another indication that he did it. A good team uses 10 guys. Look at every champion as of late. They had depth and they used it. We have the depth, too. We just dont use it.


Well, actually... we didn't. Azubuike and Wright were the only notables that were worth coming off the bench. Watson didn't come until later on in the year, Belinelli had a hard time contributing, Barnes was M.I.A. all season, Pietrus played 1/2 of the season, Croshere had his moments, Patty and Kosta weren't there.

We have far more depth this year. Randolph, Wright, Azubuike, Turiaf, Williams make it 10 men deep. Then you add Watson, Hendrix, and Belinelli. If the depth isn't used, then you can say we don't use it. But last year, we had no depth.
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» Mon Aug 18, 2008 4:49 pm
like I said above his coaching style has a glass ceiling - in the post season, over 7 games, the team that plays better defense wins the series. nelly doesn't coach D. simple as that

I hate to be pessimistic, but Nels' is never going to sniff more than the second round with his playing / coaching style.

Put another coach in his situation though, and there's no way he would have squeezed out 48 wins from last years crew. the suns and nuggets did the run and gun too but they had better players and much deeper benches. he's probably the best Run and Gun coach out there, but thats not saying much
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» Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:03 pm
sfsfsfgiants wrote:
warrior 4 life85 wrote:2. managing a team with basically a 7 player rotation is hard. he was able to do it.


What told you he was able to do it? Oh, yeah, the fact that every one of the seven players that we played got burned out for the last month. Also, the fact that we were on the outside looking in on the playoffs.... again... is another indication that he did it. A good team uses 10 guys. Look at every champion as of late. They had depth and they used it. We have the depth, too. We just dont use it.

[edit]
Baron Davis #1 in minutes per game for a PG
Monta Ellis #7 in minutes per game for a SG
Stephen Jackson #4 in minutes per game for a SF

even though the stats don't prove it, Harrington and Biedrins didn't have legit back ups last year and everyone knows it.

We didn't have depth last year

nelly was able to get through that season with no serious injuries to his stars and get a winning record (remember if we were in the east we would have been like a #3 or 4 seed!). give the man some credit.
Last edited by first off on Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:50 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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» Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:38 pm
And because of that, Baron is going to blow out his knees very, very soon.
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» Mon Aug 18, 2008 5:51 pm
xbay wrote:And because of that, Baron is going to blow out his knees very, very soon.


Glad he'll do it with the clippers!

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