Players Don Nelson Will Help/Hinder

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Will Nelson's overall effect make the Warriors better or worse as a whole?

Much Better! 50 Wins!
12
29%
He'll wake up Golden State's talent... 40 wins.
26
63%
Nelson won't help. Same record.
2
5%
He'll pull a Larry Brown and actually make the team WORSE.
1
2%
 
Total votes : 41


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 8:13 am
I think Zarko will have an increased role in Nellie's offense and he'll probably average about 10-12 pts per game!!!

Monta has hit the weights during the season but it doesn't show in bulk but more in his muscles being toned and more solid...He's the type of player who relies more on his quickness so being more bulked up would hinder his performance! We all expect a breakout yr from him as well!!!

I concerned about Ike ability to fit in the run and gun offense. Poor Ike and POB might get left behind. Under Nellie Murph might get more playing time over Ike! Which nobody wants to see.

Hopefully, we'll have Murph at the 5 and Ike at the 4!!! And Foyle on the bench!!!

Too bad Nellie wasn't brought in sooner maybe we could have a better run with Harrington or drafted a Brewer or Carney both who would have excelled in our offense!!!
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 12:13 pm
I agree, Monta should not bulk up, just get a little more strength. And it looks like Troy at 5 and Ike at 4 is the plan, but I don't think POB and Ike will lag too much (like Adonal). No way Zarko's getting 10-12 points a game.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 12:15 pm
I am very intrigued by the Ike at 4 Murph at 5 scenario, so long as Murph is cool with some bumping
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 12:34 pm
coltraning wrote:I am very intrigued by the Ike at 4 Murph at 5 scenario, so long as Murph is cool with some bumping

He won't be... but it shouldn't matter in Nelly's offense. Troy will play the perimeter... and Ike will be isolated inside. The offense will probably run through Monta, Baron, and Richardson 90% of the time anyway, so the big men might not have to worry where they play on offense. All they need to do is rebound... and both can do that very well on the offensive glass.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 1:03 pm
John Patrick wrote:No way Zarko's getting 10-12 points a game.


He will... for the other team. He'll be the first player in league history to average -12 points per game.


I'm intrigued by that idea of playing Ike at 4 and Murphy at 5, although I'm not sure it's a good idea. Ike may be too lonely inside with that gameplan. Time will tell if it works or not... I'm mostly curious right now.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 1:15 pm
It worked in December (when Monty started Ike at center for 7 games or so).

Than, after the Artest trade, Ike was put on the down-low to hide his value and we didn't see too much of a Murphy/Ike team.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 1:44 pm
#32 wrote:It worked in December (when Monty started Ike at center for 7 games or so).

Than, after the Artest trade, Ike was put on the down-low to hide his value and we didn't see too much of a Murphy/Ike team.


Why would the team want to hid Ike's value? Isn't the objective to get each player to play his best game?

I have heard this statement before and am a bit confused by it. Please indulge me an explain what this means.

Thanks.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 1:54 pm
Monta put on 15 pounds last year in the weight room where he spends alot of his time :!:
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 2:20 pm
O.G. broe wrote:Monta put on 15 pounds last year in the weight room where he spends alot of his time :!:


This is great news! We don't want him to break down like Iverson does.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 2:55 pm
uptempo wrote:Why would the team want to hid Ike's value? Isn't the objective to get each player to play his best game?

I have heard this statement before and am a bit confused by it. Please indulge me an explain what this means.

Thanks.

Surely.

Golden State believes Ike Diogu is a future star. Given the choice between him and Troy Murphy, the Warriors would rather lose Murphy to give Ike starting minutes. Diogu is the future of the Warriors at power forward.

Last season, the Warriors management (believing that Ike Diogu was still somewhat unknown around the league) offered Troy Murphy to the Indiana Pacers in exchange for Ron Artest in late-December (and I'm not taking fillers into account... Murphy for Artest was the meat of the deal).

Indiana's response was simple: "Sure, we'll do business with you. But we're not taking Murphy. We'd rather have Ike Diogu for Ron Artest."

Golden State, upon hearing this, chose to bury Diogu on the bench for the majority of the season from that point on. Less minutes for Diogu meant more minutes for Murphy (who recorded a career-high 34.0 MPG last year). More minutes for Murphy meant an inflated stat-column... which, in turn, made Murphy more attractive to the trade market.

Chris Mullin intended to deal Troy Murphy this offseason (if not midway through last year). It was Golden State's hope that hiding Ike Diogu on the bench would prevent a similar incident to Indiana from happening.

They were trying to make Troy Murphy look good (so teams would be attracted to him), while doing their best to keep Ike Diogu a secret (so teams wouldn't ask for him in a trade). Once Murphy was out of the picture, they could allow Diogu to be unleashed. If teams knew that Golden State had a better option on the bench, they wouldn't offer top dollar for their starter.

That's what happened to Diogu last season.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 3:07 pm
#32 wrote:
uptempo wrote:Why would the team want to hid Ike's value? Isn't the objective to get each player to play his best game?

I have heard this statement before and am a bit confused by it. Please indulge me an explain what this means.

Thanks.

Surely.

Golden State believes Ike Diogu is a future star. Given the choice between him and Troy Murphy, the Warriors would rather lose Murphy to give Ike starting minutes. Diogu is the future of the Warriors at power forward.

Last season, the Warriors management (believing that Ike Diogu was still somewhat unknown around the league) offered Troy Murphy to the Indiana Pacers in exchange for Ron Artest in late-December (and I'm not taking fillers into account... Murphy for Artest was the meat of the deal).

Indiana's response was simple: "Sure, we'll do business with you. But we're not taking Murphy. We'd rather have Ike Diogu for Ron Artest."

Golden State, upon hearing this, chose to bury Diogu on the bench for the majority of the season from that point on. Less minutes for Diogu meant more minutes for Murphy (who recorded a career-high 34.0 MPG last year). More minutes for Murphy meant an inflated stat-column... which, in turn, made Murphy more attractive to the trade market.

Chris Mullin intended to deal Troy Murphy this offseason (if not midway through last year). It was Golden State's hope that hiding Ike Diogu on the bench would prevent a similar incident to Indiana from happening.

They were trying to make Troy Murphy look good (so teams would be attracted to him), while doing their best to keep Ike Diogu a secret (so teams wouldn't ask for him in a trade). Once Murphy was out of the picture, they could allow Diogu to be unleashed. If teams knew that Golden State had a better option on the bench, they wouldn't offer top dollar for their starter.

That's what happened to Diogu last season.


So, are you saying that Chris Mullin controlled the playing time of the players? Isn't that the coach's responsibility? Was Monty complicit with sitting Ike and playing Murphy?
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 3:55 pm
No, not necessarily Mullin. It was the organization as a whole that shared the same goal. You can't say Mike Montgomery didn't want to get rid of Troy Murphy just as badly as anybody. Murphy and him butted heads second to only Baron and Montgomery.

Diogu's hiding was a joint effort, involving Higgins, Mullin, Montgomery, Cohan, ect... everybody was on the same page as far as a Troy Murphy trade. If hiding Diogu on the bench was the best way to do that, than the organization did what they had to do.

Murphy and Fisher were going to be dealt away to free up time for the rookies. But there's no reason to show other teams the ace up your sleeve prematurely. Golden State knew Diogu and Ellis had game. The rest of the league didn't. In trade terms, that's good business. Unfortunately, nobody bit on a Troy Murphy trade, so I wouldn't expect him to be pushed so hard this year to up his stats. Expect Murphy's minutes to drop to 28-29 minutes a night now that Golden State knows that teams aren't gunning for him.

But, to answer your question, do I believe that Chris Mullin chooses how many minutes Dunleavy, Murphy, Foyle, and Fisher saw last year...? Of course not. But the organization (as a whole) wanted exposure for Murphy and they wanted to keep Ellis & Diogu a secret. Everything else was Montgomery's doing.

In order to up the trade value of Murphy, he was given a ton of minutes (which equated to higher stats) and that was suppose to make him easier to deal away. It didn't exactly happen that way.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 4:03 pm
#32 wrote:In order to up the trade value of Murphy, he was given a ton of minutes (which equated to higher stats) and that was suppose to make him easier to deal away. It didn't exactly happen that way.


Sounds like a horrible strategy.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 5:09 pm
Why?

Troy Murphy was the road-block in front of Ike Diogu, so they wanted to trade him away for a position in need (like SF or center).

To maximize the effect of the trade (aka, get the best player possible in return) they wanted to make Murphy look better than he really is.

That doesn't sound like a horrible idea to me.
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 01, 2006 5:31 pm
Seems like pretty standard procedure...
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